Average vs. Great Pro shop
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Average vs. Great Pro shop
In your opinion, what makes a pro shop good to great, or what are the little things that your PSO does that has you coming back?
For me, it may seem small, but when I get my inserts replaced, my PSO uses a razor to trim the top of the insert so that they are flush with the ball. It's something small, but it shows his attention to detail and great customer service.
For me, it may seem small, but when I get my inserts replaced, my PSO uses a razor to trim the top of the insert so that they are flush with the ball. It's something small, but it shows his attention to detail and great customer service.
My current Stats:
RH
PAP: 5" over and 1" up
Speed: 14.5-15.5 MPH at Monitor
Rev rate: approx. 250-300 rpm
Tilt: 13-15 degrees
RH
PAP: 5" over and 1" up
Speed: 14.5-15.5 MPH at Monitor
Rev rate: approx. 250-300 rpm
Tilt: 13-15 degrees
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Re: Average vs. Great Pro shop
Did he use acetone to smooth out the razor cuts? A router works better than a razor but again some shops don't even trim them.
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Kegel Certified Pro Shop Operator
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- Member
- Posts: 31
- Joined: June 1st, 2015, 7:20 pm
- THS Average: 180
- Positive Axis Point: 4 1/2" over and 1/2" up
- Speed: 14-15 MPH, Qubica Monitor
Re: Average vs. Great Pro shop
He did use acetone to smooth out the cuts. The other pro shop I used never trimmed inserts. Again, I really love the personal touch and attention to detail.
My current Stats:
RH
PAP: 5" over and 1" up
Speed: 14.5-15.5 MPH at Monitor
Rev rate: approx. 250-300 rpm
Tilt: 13-15 degrees
RH
PAP: 5" over and 1" up
Speed: 14.5-15.5 MPH at Monitor
Rev rate: approx. 250-300 rpm
Tilt: 13-15 degrees
- spmcgivern
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Re: Average vs. Great Pro shop
For me, I wouldn't consider the trimming of inserts the one aspect that makes an average pro shop a great one.
For each person, there will be something that causes them to return to a particular pro shop. Perhaps it is trimming the insert. Maybe it is the dialogue between the two on the next ball purchase, consistency in drillings between balls, turnaround on drilling of balls, or, something I like to see, a pro shop that does not push only the brand(s) they are sponsored by.
For each person, there will be something that causes them to return to a particular pro shop. Perhaps it is trimming the insert. Maybe it is the dialogue between the two on the next ball purchase, consistency in drillings between balls, turnaround on drilling of balls, or, something I like to see, a pro shop that does not push only the brand(s) they are sponsored by.
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Re: Average vs. Great Pro shop
If they are put in right inserts shouldn't need to be cut.
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Re: Average vs. Great Pro shop
How does one use acetone to smooth out the inserts?
Senior Bowler
Tilt 23
Rot 20-40
Speed off hand 17-18
Rev 200-250
PAP 4 5/8 over 1 up RH'd 185+ On THS
Tilt 23
Rot 20-40
Speed off hand 17-18
Rev 200-250
PAP 4 5/8 over 1 up RH'd 185+ On THS
- EricHartwell
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Re: Average vs. Great Pro shop
If the fingers are drilled without pitch or lateral.channelsurfer wrote:If they are put in right inserts shouldn't need to be cut.
But due to the angle of the hole it is not possible to have the top of the insert flush to the edges of the hole without trimming or using excessive amount of glue and deforming the insert holding it place.
Eric Hartwell
Right Handed
PAP 4.75" up 1/2"
45* rotation
12* tilt
330 rev rate
16 mph off hand
Right Handed
PAP 4.75" up 1/2"
45* rotation
12* tilt
330 rev rate
16 mph off hand
- MegaMav
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Re: Average vs. Great Pro shop
The edges of the inserts can be "tucked in" while the glue is wet to avoid cutting.
Acetone should only be used to remove a little glue spill over.
Acetone and cutting on grips tells me the person is not a true craftsman.
Acetone should only be used to remove a little glue spill over.
Acetone and cutting on grips tells me the person is not a true craftsman.
Re: Average vs. Great Pro shop
Have fun trying to keep the oval shape intact and be a real craftsmen with finger inserts with a lot of pitch in them. I'd rather trim them and keep the shape intact
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Re: Average vs. Great Pro shop
You can tuck inserts if you don't have too much pitch in the holes where you will insert them. Inserts in a hole with significant reverse, especially if the hole is vaccu, will need to be cut, trying to tuck them in will most likely deform the oval, true craftmen have quality tools and know how to use them, a router does the job best. A razor and acetone are more of an improvisation/jury rig and don't look professional but it's better than just a razor as it will always leave ugly edges. Better yet, use no inserts and avoid all of this.
Silver Level Coach
Kegel KCMP1 and KCMP2 Completed /Approved Exam
Kegel KCMP3 Completed
Kegel Certified Pro Shop Operator
Free agent
Kegel KCMP1 and KCMP2 Completed /Approved Exam
Kegel KCMP3 Completed
Kegel Certified Pro Shop Operator
Free agent
- MegaMav
- Moderator
- Posts: 4694
- Joined: April 27th, 2007, 5:00 am
- THS Average: 225
- Sport Average: 200
- Positive Axis Point: 5.5 Over & 1 Up
- Speed: 16.0 MPH - Camera
- Rev Rate: 375
- Axis Tilt: 14
- Axis Rotation: 45
- Heavy Oil Ball: Radical - Informer
- Medium Oil Ball: Brunswick - Fearless
- Light Oil Ball: Radical - Bonus Pearl
- Preferred Company: Radical Bowling Technologies
- Location: Malta, NY
Re: Average vs. Great Pro shop
There will always be exceptions and extreme cases, but most average cases, inserts can be tucked in.
What separates Pro Shops from Am Shops is the ability to satisfy the customer by allowing them to bowl pain free, enjoy bowling and bowl more often. This grows the sport and your customer base.
That statement encompasses modern fitting, modern layouts, tuning, and finishing work with great customer service.
Always be the bowler's advocate, do the right thing. You'll sleep well at night.
What separates Pro Shops from Am Shops is the ability to satisfy the customer by allowing them to bowl pain free, enjoy bowling and bowl more often. This grows the sport and your customer base.
That statement encompasses modern fitting, modern layouts, tuning, and finishing work with great customer service.
Always be the bowler's advocate, do the right thing. You'll sleep well at night.
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- Member
- Posts: 31
- Joined: June 1st, 2015, 7:20 pm
- THS Average: 180
- Positive Axis Point: 4 1/2" over and 1/2" up
- Speed: 14-15 MPH, Qubica Monitor
Re: Average vs. Great Pro shop
I have a decent amount of reverse in my fingers due to flexibility issues. I appreciate the trimmed inserts. It was certainly better than another proshop I went to, where they simply glued them in with the edges stick out a bit. When I asked if they could do something about it, the operator told me, "Well, you don't roll the ball over the fingers, so you'll be fine."
My current Stats:
RH
PAP: 5" over and 1" up
Speed: 14.5-15.5 MPH at Monitor
Rev rate: approx. 250-300 rpm
Tilt: 13-15 degrees
RH
PAP: 5" over and 1" up
Speed: 14.5-15.5 MPH at Monitor
Rev rate: approx. 250-300 rpm
Tilt: 13-15 degrees
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- Trusted Source
- Posts: 1386
- Joined: December 14th, 2014, 3:08 am
- Preferred Company: Radical
- Location: San Juan, PR
Re: Average vs. Great Pro shop
I believe there is a USBC rule which states that inserts are not allowed to be sticking out in competition.
Silver Level Coach
Kegel KCMP1 and KCMP2 Completed /Approved Exam
Kegel KCMP3 Completed
Kegel Certified Pro Shop Operator
Free agent
Kegel KCMP1 and KCMP2 Completed /Approved Exam
Kegel KCMP3 Completed
Kegel Certified Pro Shop Operator
Free agent
- MegaMav
- Moderator
- Posts: 4694
- Joined: April 27th, 2007, 5:00 am
- THS Average: 225
- Sport Average: 200
- Positive Axis Point: 5.5 Over & 1 Up
- Speed: 16.0 MPH - Camera
- Rev Rate: 375
- Axis Tilt: 14
- Axis Rotation: 45
- Heavy Oil Ball: Radical - Informer
- Medium Oil Ball: Brunswick - Fearless
- Light Oil Ball: Radical - Bonus Pearl
- Preferred Company: Radical Bowling Technologies
- Location: Malta, NY
Re: Average vs. Great Pro shop
From the master, John Jameson on the "tucking in" I was talking about:
[youtube][/youtube]
[youtube][/youtube]
- snick
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Re: Average vs. Great Pro shop
A great proshop...
will watch a bowler throw the ball and get his PAP and tilt prior to drilling a new ball.
will check the fit of every customer, even those that insist that they already have a good fit.
will check the static weights of every ball before it leaves the shop.
will adjust the surface of every ball to match the lane condition and bowler style.
will watch a bowler throw the ball and get his PAP and tilt prior to drilling a new ball.
will check the fit of every customer, even those that insist that they already have a good fit.
will check the static weights of every ball before it leaves the shop.
will adjust the surface of every ball to match the lane condition and bowler style.
Benchmark Bowling Pro Shop
Byron
RH
PAP: 5.5625 x .625 up
REVRATE: 360
SPEED: 17mph at release
AR: 55º
AT: 17º
Byron
RH
PAP: 5.5625 x .625 up
REVRATE: 360
SPEED: 17mph at release
AR: 55º
AT: 17º
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Re: Average vs. Great Pro shop
Have 1/2 reverse and 1/2 lateral in one finger and never had to trim a grip......unless you have some ridiculous pitches you should never have to trim a grip or use excessive amounts of glue to make it sit flush.EricHartwell wrote:
If the fingers are drilled without pitch or lateral.
But due to the angle of the hole it is not possible to have the top of the insert flush to the edges of the hole without trimming or using excessive amount of glue and deforming the insert holding it place.
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Re: Average vs. Great Pro shop
With 1/2" reverse if you used vaccu you would have to trim them, if your holes are 31/31(insert size) then no.
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Kegel KCMP1 and KCMP2 Completed /Approved Exam
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Kegel KCMP3 Completed
Kegel Certified Pro Shop Operator
Free agent
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Re: Average vs. Great Pro shop
I like to reset the inner hole to something a little less steep and then I glue the bottom back slightly under the back of the hole. When I glue the top front, I lift the insert with my finger till it is flush. I use 3/4 reverse in mine and do not have to trim. Insert is flush in the front and does not stick out of the hole. Inner hole is 1/8" reverse by 1/4" left and right. If I am drilling fingers deep, I switch to a slightly smaller bit & go with pitches that won't hit. (3 different bits in same finger hole).TonyPR wrote:With 1/2" reverse if you used vaccu you would have to trim them, if your holes are 31/31(insert size) then no.
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- Preferred Company: Storm
Re: Average vs. Great Pro shop
Slightly revising my original question, if one has to use acetone to clean up the cuts, how is it done?
Senior Bowler
Tilt 23
Rot 20-40
Speed off hand 17-18
Rev 200-250
PAP 4 5/8 over 1 up RH'd 185+ On THS
Tilt 23
Rot 20-40
Speed off hand 17-18
Rev 200-250
PAP 4 5/8 over 1 up RH'd 185+ On THS
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Re: Average vs. Great Pro shop
Put some acetone on the corner of a paper towel and rub the area of the grip you want to smooth out (it's best to use chemical resistant gloves). The acetone will slowly dissolve the rubber in the rubbed area. -- JohnP