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 Post subject: Average vs. Great Pro shop
 Posted: Sat Sep 03, 2016 7:29 pm Post Number: #1 Post
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In your opinion, what makes a pro shop good to great, or what are the little things that your PSO does that has you coming back?

For me, it may seem small, but when I get my inserts replaced, my PSO uses a razor to trim the top of the insert so that they are flush with the ball. It's something small, but it shows his attention to detail and great customer service.

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 Post subject: Re: Average vs. Great Pro shop
 Posted: Sun Sep 04, 2016 11:56 pm Post Number: #2 Post
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Did he use acetone to smooth out the razor cuts? A router works better than a razor but again some shops don't even trim them.


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 Post subject: Re: Average vs. Great Pro shop
 Posted: Mon Sep 05, 2016 1:47 am Post Number: #3 Post
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He did use acetone to smooth out the cuts. The other pro shop I used never trimmed inserts. Again, I really love the personal touch and attention to detail.

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PAP: 5" over and 1" up
Speed: 14.5-15.5 MPH at Monitor
Rev rate: approx. 250-300 rpm
Tilt: 13-15 degrees


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 Post subject: Re: Average vs. Great Pro shop
 Posted: Tue Sep 06, 2016 2:47 pm Post Number: #4 Post
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For me, I wouldn't consider the trimming of inserts the one aspect that makes an average pro shop a great one.

For each person, there will be something that causes them to return to a particular pro shop. Perhaps it is trimming the insert. Maybe it is the dialogue between the two on the next ball purchase, consistency in drillings between balls, turnaround on drilling of balls, or, something I like to see, a pro shop that does not push only the brand(s) they are sponsored by.


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 Post subject: Re: Average vs. Great Pro shop
 Posted: Sun Sep 11, 2016 11:58 pm Post Number: #5 Post
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If they are put in right inserts shouldn't need to be cut.


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 Post subject: Re: Average vs. Great Pro shop
 Posted: Mon Sep 12, 2016 12:20 am Post Number: #6 Post
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How does one use acetone to smooth out the inserts?

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 Post subject: Re: Average vs. Great Pro shop
 Posted: Mon Sep 12, 2016 12:34 am Post Number: #7 Post
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channelsurfer wrote:
If they are put in right inserts shouldn't need to be cut.


If the fingers are drilled without pitch or lateral.
But due to the angle of the hole it is not possible to have the top of the insert flush to the edges of the hole without trimming or using excessive amount of glue and deforming the insert holding it place.

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 Post subject: Re: Average vs. Great Pro shop
 Posted: Mon Sep 12, 2016 3:16 am Post Number: #8 Post
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The edges of the inserts can be "tucked in" while the glue is wet to avoid cutting.
Acetone should only be used to remove a little glue spill over.
Acetone and cutting on grips tells me the person is not a true craftsman.

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 Post subject: Re: Average vs. Great Pro shop
 Posted: Mon Sep 12, 2016 11:22 am Post Number: #9 Post
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Have fun trying to keep the oval shape intact and be a real craftsmen with finger inserts with a lot of pitch in them. I'd rather trim them and keep the shape intact


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 Post subject: Re: Average vs. Great Pro shop
 Posted: Mon Sep 12, 2016 12:07 pm Post Number: #10 Post
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You can tuck inserts if you don't have too much pitch in the holes where you will insert them. Inserts in a hole with significant reverse, especially if the hole is vaccu, will need to be cut, trying to tuck them in will most likely deform the oval, true craftmen have quality tools and know how to use them, a router does the job best. A razor and acetone are more of an improvisation/jury rig and don't look professional but it's better than just a razor as it will always leave ugly edges. Better yet, use no inserts and avoid all of this.


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 Post subject: Re: Average vs. Great Pro shop
 Posted: Mon Sep 12, 2016 2:42 pm Post Number: #11 Post
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There will always be exceptions and extreme cases, but most average cases, inserts can be tucked in.
What separates Pro Shops from Am Shops is the ability to satisfy the customer by allowing them to bowl pain free, enjoy bowling and bowl more often. This grows the sport and your customer base.

That statement encompasses modern fitting, modern layouts, tuning, and finishing work with great customer service.
Always be the bowler's advocate, do the right thing. You'll sleep well at night.

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 Post subject: Re: Average vs. Great Pro shop
 Posted: Mon Sep 12, 2016 3:02 pm Post Number: #12 Post
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I have a decent amount of reverse in my fingers due to flexibility issues. I appreciate the trimmed inserts. It was certainly better than another proshop I went to, where they simply glued them in with the edges stick out a bit. When I asked if they could do something about it, the operator told me, "Well, you don't roll the ball over the fingers, so you'll be fine."

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PAP: 5" over and 1" up
Speed: 14.5-15.5 MPH at Monitor
Rev rate: approx. 250-300 rpm
Tilt: 13-15 degrees


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 Post subject: Re: Average vs. Great Pro shop
 Posted: Mon Sep 12, 2016 3:13 pm Post Number: #13 Post
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I believe there is a USBC rule which states that inserts are not allowed to be sticking out in competition.


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 Post subject: Re: Average vs. Great Pro shop
 Posted: Mon Sep 12, 2016 3:33 pm Post Number: #14 Post
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From the master, John Jameson on the "tucking in" I was talking about:


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 Post subject: Re: Average vs. Great Pro shop
 Posted: Mon Sep 12, 2016 4:22 pm Post Number: #15 Post
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A great proshop...
will watch a bowler throw the ball and get his PAP and tilt prior to drilling a new ball.
will check the fit of every customer, even those that insist that they already have a good fit.
will check the static weights of every ball before it leaves the shop.
will adjust the surface of every ball to match the lane condition and bowler style.

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 Post subject: Re: Average vs. Great Pro shop
 Posted: Tue Sep 13, 2016 5:03 am Post Number: #16 Post
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EricHartwell wrote:

If the fingers are drilled without pitch or lateral.
But due to the angle of the hole it is not possible to have the top of the insert flush to the edges of the hole without trimming or using excessive amount of glue and deforming the insert holding it place.

Have 1/2 reverse and 1/2 lateral in one finger and never had to trim a grip......unless you have some ridiculous pitches you should never have to trim a grip or use excessive amounts of glue to make it sit flush.


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 Post subject: Re: Average vs. Great Pro shop
 Posted: Tue Sep 13, 2016 2:18 pm Post Number: #17 Post
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With 1/2" reverse if you used vaccu you would have to trim them, if your holes are 31/31(insert size) then no.


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 Post subject: Re: Average vs. Great Pro shop
 Posted: Tue Sep 13, 2016 7:59 pm Post Number: #18 Post
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TonyPR wrote:
With 1/2" reverse if you used vaccu you would have to trim them, if your holes are 31/31(insert size) then no.

I like to reset the inner hole to something a little less steep and then I glue the bottom back slightly under the back of the hole. When I glue the top front, I lift the insert with my finger till it is flush. I use 3/4 reverse in mine and do not have to trim. Insert is flush in the front and does not stick out of the hole. Inner hole is 1/8" reverse by 1/4" left and right. If I am drilling fingers deep, I switch to a slightly smaller bit & go with pitches that won't hit. (3 different bits in same finger hole).


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 Post subject: Re: Average vs. Great Pro shop
 Posted: Tue Sep 13, 2016 11:16 pm Post Number: #19 Post
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Slightly revising my original question, if one has to use acetone to clean up the cuts, how is it done?

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 Post subject: Re: Average vs. Great Pro shop
 Posted: Wed Sep 14, 2016 5:21 pm Post Number: #20 Post
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Put some acetone on the corner of a paper towel and rub the area of the grip you want to smooth out (it's best to use chemical resistant gloves). The acetone will slowly dissolve the rubber in the rubbed area. -- JohnP


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