Board index » General Forums » Ball Talk




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 20 posts ] 
Author Message
 Post subject: Increasing length.
 Posted: Sun Nov 21, 2010 10:48 pm Post Number: #1 Post
Offline
Member

Joined: November 13, 2010
Posts: 3
Increasing Length

Besides for changing the layout, what is best to increase length on a bowling ball? I started using a weaker release (up the back with just a smidgen on the side) , I just added polish. Will adding 4000 in conjunction to the polish help?

Tap.

thanks in advance for whatever help given.


Top 
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Increasing length.
 Posted: Mon Nov 22, 2010 3:40 am Post Number: #2 Post
Offline
Member

Joined: January 29, 2010
Posts: 388
Location: cape girardeau , mo
Tap wrote:
Increasing Length

Besides for changing the layout, what is best to increase length on a bowling ball? I started using a weaker release (up the back with just a smidgen on the side) , I just added polish. Will adding 4000 in conjunction to the polish help?

Tap.

thanks in advance for whatever help given.



Yes. a surface change and then polish will help...the other thing to try is a product with a slip agent in it ....Like XXX by Black Magic or a Power House product....Steve S


Top 
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Increasing length.
 Posted: Tue Nov 23, 2010 5:23 pm Post Number: #3 Post
Offline
Member
User avatar

Joined: November 9, 2010
Posts: 25
Location: Parkersburg, WV
I personally prefer Control-It for getting maximum length... Great product!

_________________
M I N I - M O

PAP: 3 1/2 x 5/8 up
Tilt: 10°
Rotation: 80°
Speed: 18.5 mph off the hand
Rev Rate: 350 rpm

MoRich Perpetual MOtion - 70/4/45
MoRich RipR - 65/3.75/30 P3
Brunswick Avalanche Urethane - 65/3.5/35
Brunswick Power Groove Reactive - 80/3/50
Faball High Rev 3D Offset - DT


Top 
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Increasing length.
 Posted: Sat Nov 27, 2010 1:12 am Post Number: #4 Post
Offline
Member
User avatar

Joined: February 9, 2010
Posts: 179
Location: So Cal
Tap wrote:
Increasing Length

Besides for changing the layout, what is best to increase length on a bowling ball? I started using a weaker release (up the back with just a smidgen on the side) , I just added polish. Will adding 4000 in conjunction to the polish help?

Tap.

thanks in advance for whatever help given.



3m finess it or turtle wax both works well adding a few more feet.


Top 
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Increasing length.
 Posted: Sat Nov 27, 2010 1:13 pm Post Number: #5 Post
Offline
Member
User avatar

Joined: November 9, 2010
Posts: 25
Location: Parkersburg, WV
I would stick with using products made for BOWLING BALLS... using products designed for polishing cars is not recommended. There is enough of a variety of ball polishes and compounds available to achieve the reaction you are looking for. I don't know of a product that gives you more length than Control-It.

_________________
M I N I - M O

PAP: 3 1/2 x 5/8 up
Tilt: 10°
Rotation: 80°
Speed: 18.5 mph off the hand
Rev Rate: 350 rpm

MoRich Perpetual MOtion - 70/4/45
MoRich RipR - 65/3.75/30 P3
Brunswick Avalanche Urethane - 65/3.5/35
Brunswick Power Groove Reactive - 80/3/50
Faball High Rev 3D Offset - DT


Top 
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Increasing length.
 Posted: Fri Dec 03, 2010 11:30 pm Post Number: #6 Post
Offline
Member
User avatar

Joined: February 9, 2010
Posts: 179
Location: So Cal
Mo Balls wrote:
I would stick with using products made for BOWLING BALLS... using products designed for polishing cars is not recommended. There is enough of a variety of ball polishes and compounds available to achieve the reaction you are looking for. I don't know of a product that gives you more length than Control-It.



3m finess it


Top 
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Increasing length.
 Posted: Sat Dec 04, 2010 3:19 am Post Number: #7 Post
Offline
Member
User avatar

Joined: November 9, 2010
Posts: 25
Location: Parkersburg, WV
odddood wrote:
Mo Balls wrote:
I would stick with using products made for BOWLING BALLS... using products designed for polishing cars is not recommended. There is enough of a variety of ball polishes and compounds available to achieve the reaction you are looking for. I don't know of a product that gives you more length than Control-It.



3m finess it


Finess It is not USBC approved, which means it hasn't been tested to be safe for use on bowling balls. It also does not contain any siloxanes, therefor makes it a medium length polish (equivalent to factory finish). Unlike Control-It, Delayed Reaction, and Black Magic XXX; all containing siloxane slip agents to maximize length through the front part of the lane.

_________________
M I N I - M O

PAP: 3 1/2 x 5/8 up
Tilt: 10°
Rotation: 80°
Speed: 18.5 mph off the hand
Rev Rate: 350 rpm

MoRich Perpetual MOtion - 70/4/45
MoRich RipR - 65/3.75/30 P3
Brunswick Avalanche Urethane - 65/3.5/35
Brunswick Power Groove Reactive - 80/3/50
Faball High Rev 3D Offset - DT


Top 
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Increasing length.
 Posted: Sat Dec 04, 2010 5:33 am Post Number: #8 Post
Offline
Member

Joined: January 29, 2010
Posts: 388
Location: cape girardeau , mo
" Finess It is not USBC approved, which means it hasn't been tested to be safe for use on bowling balls."

The last time I checked the list it was approved for use before play,not during ....It also is a scratch remover ( so it contains grit ) not just a polish ....It will change the surface on the ball...Steve S


Top 
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Increasing length.
 Posted: Sat Dec 04, 2010 4:56 pm Post Number: #9 Post
Offline
Member
User avatar

Joined: November 9, 2010
Posts: 25
Location: Parkersburg, WV
Finesse-It 2 is approved for use...

I never said it wouldn't change the surface of the ball. It is a medium length polish. I am only imparting my opinion. There are many better polishes and compounds for achieving the desired surface and length.

_________________
M I N I - M O

PAP: 3 1/2 x 5/8 up
Tilt: 10°
Rotation: 80°
Speed: 18.5 mph off the hand
Rev Rate: 350 rpm

MoRich Perpetual MOtion - 70/4/45
MoRich RipR - 65/3.75/30 P3
Brunswick Avalanche Urethane - 65/3.5/35
Brunswick Power Groove Reactive - 80/3/50
Faball High Rev 3D Offset - DT


Top 
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Increasing length.
 Posted: Sat Dec 04, 2010 7:24 pm Post Number: #10 Post
Offline
Mo Pinel
User avatar

Joined: January 26, 2010
Posts: 10054
odddood wrote:
Tap wrote:
Increasing Length

Besides for changing the layout, what is best to increase length on a bowling ball? I started using a weaker release (up the back with just a smidgen on the side) , I just added polish. Will adding 4000 in conjunction to the polish help?

Tap.

thanks in advance for whatever help given.



3m finess it or turtle wax both works well adding a few more feet.


I definitely prefer polishes WITHOUT wax in them.


Top 
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Increasing length.
 Posted: Sat Dec 04, 2010 7:25 pm Post Number: #11 Post
Offline
Mo Pinel
User avatar

Joined: January 26, 2010
Posts: 10054
odddood wrote:
Mo Balls wrote:
I would stick with using products made for BOWLING BALLS... using products designed for polishing cars is not recommended. There is enough of a variety of ball polishes and compounds available to achieve the reaction you are looking for. I don't know of a product that gives you more length than Control-It.



3m finess it


NOT TRUE!


Top 
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Increasing length.
 Posted: Sat Dec 04, 2010 7:31 pm Post Number: #12 Post
Offline
Mo Pinel
User avatar

Joined: January 26, 2010
Posts: 10054
Mo Balls wrote:
Finesse-It 2 is approved for use...

I never said it wouldn't change the surface of the ball. It is a medium length polish. I am only imparting my opinion. There are many better polishes and compounds for achieving the desired surface and length.


As was mentioned, length is best achieved by polishes with slip agents added. Extender polishes, XXX, and Control-It come to mind. I like Control It the best. If you want maximum length WITHOUT a slip agent, try Storm Xtra Shine. I like it, but Control-It will create more skid because of the slip aid.


Top 
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Increasing length.
 Posted: Sun Dec 05, 2010 3:42 am Post Number: #13 Post
Offline
Trusted Source
User avatar

Joined: May 11, 2010
Posts: 219
how do you feel about secret sauce?


Top 
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Increasing length.
 Posted: Sun Dec 05, 2010 8:40 am Post Number: #14 Post
Offline
Senior Member
User avatar

Joined: November 18, 2010
Posts: 1056
Location: Coeur D A'lene, ID
What about using 5k grit diamond sand paper with the Control It polish? Can you say ultra dry lane ball with a control layout?

_________________
Stats:
Right handed
Pap is 4 3/4 x 3/8 up currently
Speed around 16.5 off hand
Tilt in the 14-16* range
Rev rate: around 325 - 350 or so
Axis rotation in the 25-70* range
I bowl on Brunswick synthetics. Ths...


Top 
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Increasing length.
 Posted: Sun Dec 05, 2010 3:07 pm Post Number: #15 Post
Offline
Member

Joined: September 29, 2010
Posts: 330
at some point are you going to have diminishing returns? Think about how powerful the ballls are now and how much energy the skid snap balls store, now make the ball slicker with even finer polishing methods. Will you eventually get the ball reaction totally uncontrolable or will the balll cover finally be weakened enough to actually calm down the reaction when it does finally read the lane? At some point you need to start playing what the lane is giving you instead of trying to out think or over power the lane.


Top 
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Increasing length.
 Posted: Sun Dec 05, 2010 5:04 pm Post Number: #16 Post
Offline
Member
User avatar

Joined: November 9, 2010
Posts: 25
Location: Parkersburg, WV
crazyjim wrote:
at some point are you going to have diminishing returns? Think about how powerful the ballls are now and how much energy the skid snap balls store, now make the ball slicker with even finer polishing methods. Will you eventually get the ball reaction totally uncontrolable or will the balll cover finally be weakened enough to actually calm down the reaction when it does finally read the lane? At some point you need to start playing what the lane is giving you instead of trying to out think or over power the lane.


If you use a polish that contains a slip agent, it will not give you the over-snap on the backend. The slip aids help limit the friction on the dry part of the lane, giving you a smoother reaction off the spot. The best answer for smoothing out the hook zone is still a P1 hole though.

_________________
M I N I - M O

PAP: 3 1/2 x 5/8 up
Tilt: 10°
Rotation: 80°
Speed: 18.5 mph off the hand
Rev Rate: 350 rpm

MoRich Perpetual MOtion - 70/4/45
MoRich RipR - 65/3.75/30 P3
Brunswick Avalanche Urethane - 65/3.5/35
Brunswick Power Groove Reactive - 80/3/50
Faball High Rev 3D Offset - DT


Top 
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Increasing length.
 Posted: Tue Dec 07, 2010 12:53 am Post Number: #17 Post
Offline
Member

Joined: June 25, 2009
Posts: 267
You can add Valentino's UFO to the list of polishes with slip agents in them.UFO seems to contain some kind of organic slip agent that is much more easily removed than those used by Control-It or Delayed Reaction. A simple swipe (almost) with a 4000 grit pad is enough to remove UFO, whereas Delayed Reaction and Control-It require a thorough sanding down to about a 600 grit US/CAMI or P1000 grit Abralon level to remove the silicone.

And, yes, all of them will not only add length, they will also reduce the overall amount of hook AND the amount of backend.

No one seemed to add the obvious bowler-specific ways to add length:
- more loft
- make your target further down the lane, along your original line of sight.

_________________
Right handed
Speed: 13.5 -14.5 at pin deck
Rev Rate: 275 - 350
Axis rotation: 45*
Axis tilt: 17*
PAP: 5" x 0"


Top 
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Increasing length.
 Posted: Tue Dec 07, 2010 5:23 am Post Number: #18 Post
Offline
Member
User avatar

Joined: October 21, 2010
Posts: 118
Location: Coatesville, PA
Thank you everybody who responded to this. This is a question that I have just recently been researching myself. The majority of polishes on the market will shine a ball and increase length but will not reduce backend. In fact, most polishes will increase both length and backend. In other words, the ball will go farther down the lane before it hooks, but will still hook just as much. So most polishes just have the effect of making a ball more angular. Not the effect I have been looking for.

I bowl on older wood with Guardian, and we have been seeing issues with oil breaking down by the start of game 2 in our league, resulting in numerous large splits through games 2 and 3. Even shelling down to entry level stuff or urethane has not helped much. I have been looking at Neo-Tac Control It or Ebonite Delayed Reaction as a possible solution, as both products advertise that they increase length and decrease backend. Reading what you all have written here, I now really want to try one of these products.

_________________
- “We can't solve problems by using the same kind of thinking we used when we created them.” - Albert Einstein

- "The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result." - Albert Einstein


Top 
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Increasing length.
 Posted: Tue Dec 07, 2010 6:02 am Post Number: #19 Post
Offline
Member
User avatar

Joined: October 21, 2010
Posts: 118
Location: Coatesville, PA
Can anybody tell me how much these products like Control It or Delayed Reaction will reduce a ball's reaction? How many coats are recommended? Lastly, would it be possible to apply these products to a urethane ball, or are they best suited for resin balls? I am trying to decide which ball I want to try this stuff on. Thanks in advance for any help.

My stats:

Tilt: 13 - 15
Rotation: 65 - 70
Speed: 15.3 - 16 off hand
Revs: 180 - 200

_________________
- “We can't solve problems by using the same kind of thinking we used when we created them.” - Albert Einstein

- "The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result." - Albert Einstein


Top 
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Increasing length.
 Posted: Tue Dec 07, 2010 7:52 am Post Number: #20 Post
Offline
Member

Joined: January 18, 2010
Posts: 902
Location: Northern California
Go with the control it.. It works way better than delayed reaction..
I used delayed reaction on a urethane ball I had that I was using for 10 pins..
taking to a higher grit and applying many coats of delayed reaction didn't do the job..The ball still had too much backend..
I used control it and it did the job perfectly..killed the reaction..

If I had to guess, I would say it cut the reaction in half.

I put the ball back to the high grit and applied control it when I started seeing the ball wanting to react more than usual.

_________________
Right Handed, 18 -19 mph off hand (16 - 17 mph on Qubica reading) ,350 rpm,PAP 4 3/4 x 1/4 up, 17 deg axis tilt, varied rotational axis deg.. usually 45+
Book Average 220+


Top 
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
 
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 20 posts ] 

Board index » General Forums » Ball Talk


 
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to: