What factor dominates a THS bowler for ball reaction?

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jdrsuper
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What factor dominates a THS bowler for ball reaction?

Post by jdrsuper » July 5th, 2019, 12:58 am

First I want to say that I am in no way trying to disparage anyone and will welcome rebuttals to what I'm about to posit. If my assumption are wrong then please correct me, as I'm always eager to learn. I have always read that surface on a reactive ball whether solid or pearl is the most important factor in bowling ball reaction. I believe that the most important factors and I can't rank them are: The layout,
consistent release, speed,revs, etc. The reason I leave out surface is because it is well proven that if you have a ball at say 1000 grit after a league season it will probably be around 4000 and that goes for most grits below 4000. I would bet that most THS bowlers will probably clean their balls but I'm willing to bet that most never use pads to restore the grit to what they want or what it came from the factory. This leaves me to believe that most bowlers are throwing 4000 grit reactive balls. This negates surface in my opinion the most important factor. Talking to my PSO I realized I was guilty as charged for not sanding the ball to whatever grit I wanted based on my arsenal for the next ABT tournament depending on the sport shot that is put out. I realize that many bowlers on this forum are educated and clean and sand as necessary. I'm talking about the average house shot bowler who buys the latest and greatest ball out there but lack of maintenance on the ball makes less effective because he or she is not well versed in modern bowling ball technology and doesn't properly take care of their equipment. Thanks for any replies and as I said upfront iam not trying to criticize or disparage anyone.
Joel Resnick
Hand: Left
PAP: 4 11/16 over 1 up
Speed: 13 off hand
Rev Rate: 200
Axis Tilt: 24
Axis Rotation: 75

No matter what you are trying to do remember simplicity gives better results than over complicating things.

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MegaMav
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Re: What factor dominates a THS bowler for ball reaction?

Post by MegaMav » July 5th, 2019, 1:09 am

I think you should consider putting the effort in to learn how to match up rather than make excuses to not take any action at all.

Matching up and throwing the ball consistently with a good release, which means, throwing the ball with some tilt, but not too much, and some rotation, but not too much with some speed, but not too much is the key to success. Surface adjustments are significant, its how we can tune a ball to slow down at the right time. The effect of surface change lasts a league night, even an entire tournament. It doesnt need to stay the same and having a ball slow down at the right time for 2 games is better than zero frames.
“When you prepare for everything, you’re ready for anything.” - Bill Walsh

jdrsuper
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Posts: 179
Joined: March 7th, 2015, 12:44 am
Positive Axis Point: 4 11/16 over 1 up
Speed: 13 off hand
Rev Rate: 200
Axis Tilt: 24
Axis Rotation: 75
Heavy Oil Ball: Track Logix
Medium Oil Ball: Track Paradox
Light Oil Ball: Hammer Widow Black Urethane
Preferred Company: Ebonite Brands

Re: What factor dominates a THS bowler for ball reaction?

Post by jdrsuper » July 5th, 2019, 6:48 am

MegaMav wrote:I think you should consider putting the effort in to learn how to match up rather than make excuses to not take any action at all.

Matching up and throwing the ball consistently with a good release, which means, throwing the ball with some tilt, but not too much, and some rotation, but not too much with some speed, but not too much is the key to success. Surface adjustments are significant, its how we can tune a ball to slow down at the right time. The effect of surface change lasts a league night, even an entire tournament. It doesnt need to stay the same and having a ball slow down at the right time for 2 games is better than zero frames.
Megamav,
I agree with everything you said but I wasn't trying to make excuses for how I release a bowling ball and my tilt, rotation and obvious lack of speed. I merely pointed out that I wasn't taking care of my arsenal properly and I will now make sure I sand my equipment to what I need for a particular sport shot. I work at trying to reduce axis rotation and lowering my tilt but at 79 years young and with muscle memory from all the bowling I've done since I was sixteen it doesn't come easy. Hopefully when you reach my age you will still be able to bowl competitively.
Joel Resnick
Hand: Left
PAP: 4 11/16 over 1 up
Speed: 13 off hand
Rev Rate: 200
Axis Tilt: 24
Axis Rotation: 75

No matter what you are trying to do remember simplicity gives better results than over complicating things.

b3y0nd3r
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Re: What factor dominates a THS bowler for ball reaction?

Post by b3y0nd3r » July 5th, 2019, 2:26 pm

jdrsuper wrote:First I want to say that I am in no way trying to disparage anyone and will welcome rebuttals to what I'm about to posit. If my assumption are wrong then please correct me, as I'm always eager to learn. I have always read that surface on a reactive ball whether solid or pearl is the most important factor in bowling ball reaction. I believe that the most important factors and I can't rank them are: The layout,
consistent release, speed,revs, etc. The reason I leave out surface is because it is well proven that if you have a ball at say 1000 grit after a league season it will probably be around 4000 and that goes for most grits below 4000. I would bet that most THS bowlers will probably clean their balls but I'm willing to bet that most never use pads to restore the grit to what they want or what it came from the factory. This leaves me to believe that most bowlers are throwing 4000 grit reactive balls. This negates surface in my opinion the most important factor. Talking to my PSO I realized I was guilty as charged for not sanding the ball to whatever grit I wanted based on my arsenal for the next ABT tournament depending on the sport shot that is put out. I realize that many bowlers on this forum are educated and clean and sand as necessary. I'm talking about the average house shot bowler who buys the latest and greatest ball out there but lack of maintenance on the ball makes less effective because he or she is not well versed in modern bowling ball technology and doesn't properly take care of their equipment. Thanks for any replies and as I said upfront iam not trying to criticize or disparage anyone.
I am not a PSO; Having said there, here is my opinion.

I recently teamed with a left hander throwing a black widow he had for years. The ball was so oil soaked that when you touched it, it left oily prints. When he threw it, the ball had little reaction on the lane. I offered to revitalize his ball for him. I de-oiled the ball, and sanded by hand 500, 500, 1000 surface. He wasn't around for two weeks then I saw him, he bought a new ball. I told him I was done with the old one and I would bring it next week.

The result?

It took him two games to adjust but his last game was a 221. He said it was like a brand new ball and that he wished he didnt buy the other one. So revitalizing an old ball will definitely show a difference.

jdrsuper
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Member
Posts: 179
Joined: March 7th, 2015, 12:44 am
Positive Axis Point: 4 11/16 over 1 up
Speed: 13 off hand
Rev Rate: 200
Axis Tilt: 24
Axis Rotation: 75
Heavy Oil Ball: Track Logix
Medium Oil Ball: Track Paradox
Light Oil Ball: Hammer Widow Black Urethane
Preferred Company: Ebonite Brands

Re: What factor dominates a THS bowler for ball reaction?

Post by jdrsuper » July 5th, 2019, 9:41 pm

b3y0nd3r wrote:
I am not a PSO; Having said there, here is my opinion.

I recently teamed with a left hander throwing a black widow he had for years. The ball was so oil soaked that when you touched it, it left oily prints. When he threw it, the ball had little reaction on the lane. I offered to revitalize his ball for him. I de-oiled the ball, and sanded by hand 500, 500, 1000 surface. He wasn't around for two weeks then I saw him, he bought a new ball. I told him I was done with the old one and I would bring it next week.

The result?

It took him two games to adjust but his last game was a 221. He said it was like a brand new ball and that he wished he didnt buy the other one. So revitalizing an old ball will definitely show a difference.
B3y0nd3r,
I agree with what you said and did for that bowler. I think I have to clarify some things, first I clean my balls after league and abt tournaments and I have a de-oiler at home which I use when it is necessary. The point I was trying to make was that most house shot bowlers don't sand their balls and therefore most reactives resins whether soilds or pearls are at 4000 grit. Therefore surface being equal for most THS bowlers, then consistent release, layout, cores, revs, play a more important part than surface in ball reaction. As I said above I was guilty in not sanding my balls therefore not taking advantage of surface depending on the pattern and of course my specs.
Joel Resnick
Hand: Left
PAP: 4 11/16 over 1 up
Speed: 13 off hand
Rev Rate: 200
Axis Tilt: 24
Axis Rotation: 75

No matter what you are trying to do remember simplicity gives better results than over complicating things.

krava
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Re: What factor dominates a THS bowler for ball reaction?

Post by krava » July 10th, 2019, 8:10 am

I am confused at this question. It also depends on the condition etc. (For sake of argument say that you know how to release the ball properly etc because if you don't nothing might help. Throwing a ball with 0 tilt behind the back of it etc nothing you do will improve the ball motion). Lets say that you have a ton of fresh oil like 30ml or something. The single factor would be ball surface. If you couldnt' get the ball to hook and it was going to far, dulling the ball down definitely would be the biggest way to get the ball to have some reaction.

lets reverse that. Lets say that you are bowling on dry lanes, Dulling the ball would be horrible and the ball would die fast and have no reaction at all. Then switch to a high polish ball etc you might see a good reaction depending on several factors there.

I don't want to go on an on. I read a little more of what you wrote. I don't know why these bowlers buy new balls and never do any kind of maintence at all. I make sure every ball has enough surface on it for the condition that I am playing on. I make sure I don't have belt marks on there. I am learning how to deal with tape. I use white tape, black tape, red tape etc and make sure each ball has a good fit.

To have good ball reaction, you have to match up the proper ball with surface etc to the proper lane condition. Then you need to also make sure you have a good release etc. You have to make sure that your are playing in the right spot. When I bowl, I want to see some kind of oil ring on my ball, If I don't it is time to move left.

I think the single most important factor is the correct release for ball reaction. I focused today on making sure that I kept my index finger pointed toward the point I was aiming at at the bottom of one of the pins with most of the weight of the ball between the index and 3rd finger. I was also trying to get proper leverage (left foot stops ball is 6 in from ankle etc) and had very good ball reaction 34/36 frames with 2 balls thrown bad because of too early of turn on my part. I had 1 8 count and everything else was 9 or X every other shot.

I am not sure what you mean by ball reaction, Good ball reaction for me is defined as I can identify all 3 stages of the ball motion and the ball doesn't "roll out" or never gets into the hook phase etc or doesn't deflect at the pins toward the 9 when it hits the pocket.

pocket710guy
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Re: What factor dominates a THS bowler for ball reaction?

Post by pocket710guy » August 5th, 2019, 4:53 am

Pattern ( because each house is different)

Surface ( each bowler has favorite surface they like)

Cover (pearl or solid?) what works best on your house shot?

my top 3 factors.

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