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 Post subject: Low-buck heavy oil ball- Show Off?
 Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2018 3:44 pm Post Number: #1 Post
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Biggest hole in my arsenal these days is a true heavy-oil ball. I have been trying not to spend tons of money on bowling equipment these days, and I don’t expect a heavy oil ball would get a lot of use by me. I only bowl in one league and I’d call the THS there “medium” at most. More needing a “in case of flood, break glass” option for tournaments.

Roto Grip has a fairly recent release in the Show Off and I got to thinking it might be a sort-of unique opportunity. For those unfamiliar, it’s an HP-2 line ball (range is 1 thru 4) so it’s pretty reasonably priced, about $110 internet price. Symmetric core with 2.55 RG and .045 diff. What is intriguing about this ball is that it has the cover from the original No Rules solid, arguably the strongest cover in the Roto line right now.

Thinking of something like a 4-4 1/2” pin-to-pap, put the pin above my bridge and plan for a fairly large P3. Pretty close to the Radical “pin above with double thumb balance hole” fastest revving layout.

When Mav took my stats years ago, he measured the following:
Pap 3 1/2” over O up
Tilt 8 1/2” or 33 deg
Rotation 75-80 deg
Matched 300-325 rpm 18mph off hand 16.5 monitor

Guesstimating the tilt and rotation have decreased some, due to style change (lessons) and fit changes. Speed is still about the same, rev rate might be up a bit, still above average tilt. Currently over-achieving vs last season, averaging 223 with something like 7 700+ series, high this year 785/300. Again I bowl in one league and practice once a week or not at all so, while I’ll never be “satisfied”, I think I’m doing “ok”.

Good idea? Garbage idea?


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 Post subject: Re: Low-buck heavy oil ball- Show Off?
 Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2018 4:39 pm Post Number: #2 Post
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There are better deals on stronger balls out there.
If trying to save money I would be looking for a Heavy oil ball on Amazon or ebay.
As an example there is a Radical Tremendous for $109 on Amazon
I would be looking for a Strong Asymmetrical ball for your release specs and using a Benchmark layout of 20-5-55 p3. Adjust to Pin in the Middle finger. P3 is on your PAP.

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PAP 4.75" up 1/2"
45* rotation
12* tilt
330 rev rate
16 mph off hand


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 Post subject: Re: Low-buck heavy oil ball- Show Off?
 Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2018 5:40 pm Post Number: #3 Post
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I’ve seen a bunch of those in action, it seems to be the heavy oil ball of choice for a bunch of the heavy handed college bowlers in the area. It’s an interesting ball - with such a strong cover on a weaker core, it hooks on just about anything, but doesn’t seem to DRIVE on anything. The core just doesn’t seem strong enough to pick up like you see with heavy oil asyms. That’s not necessarily a bad thing, some people like having the built-in hook control. The IQ Tour has been around forever for that reason.

All that said, I look for cheap balls too when it comes to “in case of emergency, break glass” balls. In those scenarios, I’ve learned to lean on used balls. I can get them cheap even with low games, and im not going to put that many more games on them anyway.

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PAP- 4 1/8 over, 3/4 up
Speed - 17-18 monitor
Rev Rate - 475
Rotation - 65
Tilt - 12


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 Post subject: Re: Low-buck heavy oil ball- Show Off?
 Posted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 11:47 am Post Number: #4 Post
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EricHartwell wrote:
P3 is on your PAP.


Wouldn’t that make it a P1? Feel like that would neuter the ball reaction to some degree.

Forgive if I’m making a poor assumption, I know just enough to be dangerous and make bad layout choices :lol:


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 Post subject: Re: Low-buck heavy oil ball- Show Off?
 Posted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 1:20 pm Post Number: #5 Post
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buddiesproshop.com has some good deals on closeouts, like a pitbull growl for $100

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 Post subject: Re: Low-buck heavy oil ball- Show Off?
 Posted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 5:07 pm Post Number: #6 Post
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GameBreaker 2's, GB2 Phenom's, GB etal are going to be closed out I'd assume when GB3 is WWRD on 1/30. Buddies has GB2 Phenom's for $89 right now. Great low RG symm. with GB10.7 to GB11.2 covers if that what you are looking for. Good known quantity medium-heavy to heavy oil option.


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 Post subject: Re: Low-buck heavy oil ball- Show Off?
 Posted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 7:26 pm Post Number: #7 Post
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I have a Showoff and I can tell you that this cover still needs friction.

On a true heavy/long pattern the Showoff tends to "flutter" a good bit without a good turn into the pocket if there is not enough friction to be found.

When on a Heavier shot, I tend to play mine much straighter than I would normally play.. 12 - 8ish and as long as there is some friction past the pattern it will rev up and get to the hole, carry and continuation is fine even with 14lbs.

If not.. find a better option

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** UPDATED STATS AS OF 6-06-14 **
Right Hand
PAP 4 1/2-> 3/4 up
ROTATION 20 - 30
TILT 11.5*
MPH 16.7 MONITOR
RPM 350-375
http://WWW.VisionaryBowling.com
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0lQgu7EqML0 Raven Attack


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 Post subject: Re: Low-buck heavy oil ball- Show Off?
 Posted: Tue Jan 16, 2018 12:14 am Post Number: #8 Post
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56bird wrote:

Wouldn’t that make it a P1? Feel like that would neuter the ball reaction to some degree.

Forgive if I’m making a poor assumption, I know just enough to be dangerous and make bad layout choices :lol:

The Gradient line starts at P4 then extends up the VAL with P1 way above the fingers on this layout.
It does not neuter the ball reaction. Remember this is for an Asymmetrical ball. On a Symmetrical ball your assumption would be correct.
See attachment...


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Right Handed
PAP 4.75" up 1/2"
45* rotation
12* tilt
330 rev rate
16 mph off hand


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 Post subject: Re: Low-buck heavy oil ball- Show Off?
 Posted: Tue Jan 16, 2018 12:57 am Post Number: #9 Post
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I guess I was looking at an old definition “The first (P1) is always on the PAP, the fourth (P4) is always on the PSA..”. This is why I mostly stay out of layout discussions :)


EricHartwell wrote:
The Gradient line starts at P4 then extends up the VAL with P1 way above the fingers on this layout.
It does not neuter the ball reaction. Remember this is for an Asymmetrical ball. On a Symmetrical ball your assumption would be correct.
See attachment...


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 Post subject: Re: Low-buck heavy oil ball- Show Off?
 Posted: Tue Jan 16, 2018 4:33 pm Post Number: #10 Post
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Note that the P3 being on the PAP is only for this particular case, not a general rule. -- JohnP


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 Post subject: Re: Low-buck heavy oil ball- Show Off?
 Posted: Tue Jan 16, 2018 5:18 pm Post Number: #11 Post
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JohnP wrote:
Note that the P3 being on the PAP is only for this particular case, not a general rule. -- JohnP


Yeah, for me it's a weird one but it is what it is.


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