Hello everybody !
How do i adapt angle sum to different player types exactly ?
At medium Axis Rotation ( 35-55*) with medium Tilt ( 13-20° ) its 95° basic sum for benchmark layout
15 mph matched to 200 rpm
16 mph matched to 250 rpm
17 mph matched to 300 rpm
18 mph matched to 350 rpm
19 mph matched to 400 rpm
What amount in degrees to subtract for a player who has not as much revs to be matched....
17 mph with 250 rpm ...... minus 10° ?
17 mph with 200 rpm ...... minus 20° ?
17 mph with 150 rpm ...... minus 30° ?
..so for each 50 rpm less minus 10° ??
What about High Tilt ? only minus 10° for > 24°
What at 40° ?
What about High Rotation ? only minus 5° for > 60°
What at 90° ?
What exact dual angle sum adaption to unmatched players ?
Moderator: Moderators
- EricHartwell
- Trusted Source
- Posts: 4080
- Joined: April 5th, 2011, 12:24 am
- Positive Axis Point: 4-3/4" and 1/2"up
- Speed: 16 off hand
- Rev Rate: 330
- Axis Tilt: 12
- Axis Rotation: 45
- Heavy Oil Ball: Radical Tremendous, EVO solid, Hammer Obsession
- Medium Oil Ball: EVO pearl, True Motion, Columbia Command, DV8 Intimidator
- Light Oil Ball: Blue Hammer
- Location: Michigan
Re: What exact dual angle sum adaption to unmatched players
For the basic speed to rev relationship I utilize a spreadsheet that one of our members, Libra, put together by compiling recommendations from Mo.
It can be found here...
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=8770&p=69777&hilit= ... les#p69777" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Once you get the speed and revs basic total I then adjust for tilt and rotation if needed.
Add 10* for low tilt <12* or subtract 10* for high tilt >20*
For rotation I subtract 5 for high rotation >60* or add 5* for low rotation <35*
And that's it I don't adjust further.
It can be found here...
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=8770&p=69777&hilit= ... les#p69777" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Once you get the speed and revs basic total I then adjust for tilt and rotation if needed.
Add 10* for low tilt <12* or subtract 10* for high tilt >20*
For rotation I subtract 5 for high rotation >60* or add 5* for low rotation <35*
And that's it I don't adjust further.
Eric Hartwell
Right Handed
PAP 4.75" up 1/2"
45* rotation
12* tilt
330 rev rate
16 mph off hand
Right Handed
PAP 4.75" up 1/2"
45* rotation
12* tilt
330 rev rate
16 mph off hand
-
- Member
- Posts: 9
- Joined: March 11th, 2017, 3:55 am
- Preferred Company: Storm
Re: What exact dual angle sum adaption to unmatched players
Thank you Eric and plain these are two great posts
-
- Trusted Source
- Posts: 1386
- Joined: December 14th, 2014, 3:08 am
- Preferred Company: Radical
- Location: San Juan, PR
Re: What exact dual angle sum adaption to unmatched players
Thank you Eric, that's the missing link I needed in order to do layouts correctly! I feel like Keanu Reeves in The Matrix: "I know kung fu"
" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Boy I sure miss Mo around here, could someone here tell him to post a thread to just say "Hi, I am proud of you guys" or even better "you guys suck, I'll post a bit more often to show you some new stuff"...
Hello Mo, wherever you are, thank you for all you have contributed to this forum, we try to keep it as accurate as possible.
" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Boy I sure miss Mo around here, could someone here tell him to post a thread to just say "Hi, I am proud of you guys" or even better "you guys suck, I'll post a bit more often to show you some new stuff"...
Hello Mo, wherever you are, thank you for all you have contributed to this forum, we try to keep it as accurate as possible.
Silver Level Coach
Kegel KCMP1 and KCMP2 Completed /Approved Exam
Kegel KCMP3 Completed
Kegel Certified Pro Shop Operator
Free agent
Kegel KCMP1 and KCMP2 Completed /Approved Exam
Kegel KCMP3 Completed
Kegel Certified Pro Shop Operator
Free agent
- MegaMav
- Moderator
- Posts: 4694
- Joined: April 27th, 2007, 5:00 am
- THS Average: 225
- Sport Average: 200
- Positive Axis Point: 5.5 Over & 1 Up
- Speed: 16.0 MPH - Camera
- Rev Rate: 375
- Axis Tilt: 14
- Axis Rotation: 45
- Heavy Oil Ball: Radical - Informer
- Medium Oil Ball: Brunswick - Fearless
- Light Oil Ball: Radical - Bonus Pearl
- Preferred Company: Radical Bowling Technologies
- Location: Malta, NY
Re: What exact dual angle sum adaption to unmatched players
When I helped him at a seminar last month I asked about his absence.TonyPR wrote:Boy I sure miss Mo around here, could someone here tell him to post a thread to just say "Hi, I am proud of you guys" or even better "you guys suck, I'll post a bit more often to show you some new stuff"...
Hello Mo, wherever you are, thank you for all you have contributed to this forum, we try to keep it as accurate as possible.
Hes very limited on time, once time permits he will post again.
Its nothing anti-BowlingChat, just time constraints.
- snick
- BCU Graduate Layouts
- Posts: 759
- Joined: August 31st, 2014, 8:00 pm
- THS Average: 196
- Sport Average: 180
- Positive Axis Point: 5.5625" x .625 up
- Speed: 17 off hand
- Rev Rate: 360
- Axis Tilt: 17
- Axis Rotation: 55
- Heavy Oil Ball: Storm Physix
- Medium Oil Ball: Storm Streetfight
- Light Oil Ball: Rotogrip Hustle Pearl
- Preferred Company: Rotogrip
- Location: Tucson, AZ
Re: What exact dual angle sum adaption to unmatched players
I miss MO too.
I often play the 5 part above180 podcast interview with Mo in the shop while I'm working.
I often play the 5 part above180 podcast interview with Mo in the shop while I'm working.
Benchmark Bowling Pro Shop
Byron
RH
PAP: 5.5625 x .625 up
REVRATE: 360
SPEED: 17mph at release
AR: 55º
AT: 17º
Byron
RH
PAP: 5.5625 x .625 up
REVRATE: 360
SPEED: 17mph at release
AR: 55º
AT: 17º
-
- BCU Graduate Layouts
- Posts: 47
- Joined: October 2nd, 2016, 8:03 am
- Positive Axis Point: 5 1/2
- Speed: 18,3 off hand
- Rev Rate: 340
- Axis Tilt: 7-10
- Axis Rotation: 45
- Heavy Oil Ball: RG No Rules
- Medium Oil Ball: RG Devour
- Light Oil Ball: Hammer BW Spare 2000 grit
- Location: Hannover, Germany
Re: What exact dual angle sum adaption to unmatched players
Thats a nice little tool !EricHartwell wrote:For the basic speed to rev relationship I utilize a spreadsheet that one of our members, Libra, put together by compiling recommendations from Mo.
It can be found here...
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=8770&p=69777&hilit=total+angles#p69777
According to that, its a linear adaption of 5° each 100rpm or 2 mph variance
But one has to be careful, thats not for everybody. I wont believe having 11 mph and 0 rpm results in the same basic 95° angle sum as 17mph / 300rpm. Even if this is true, thats not a question of layout, thats about learning to bowl.
For myself it should be enough to work with 5 ° a the smallest unit. When i look at the area of 5° difference at a ball thinking about the variance of bowlers PAP coordinates at release, it will be just fine i think. Once a top bowler with stable PAP release should ask me for help, i will remember to calculate more accurate and dont round the sum.