You may have seen the recent United States Bowling Congress press release about USBC Coach- ing adding the two-handed delivery to their curriculum. I would like to go on record as one who believes that teaching the two- handed bowling style, though effective for some, should not be encouraged nor endorsed by our industry.
It has been about eight months since I first heard the call by some of our industry’s more respected bowling coaches that the two- handed delivery is here to stay, and coaches should learn how it is done so they can coach kids who gravitate toward that style. USBC has even enlisted the help of Australia’s Jason Belmonte (one of the most noted two-handed bowlers) to help teach it to USBC coaches who are expected to pass it on to their students.
This, in my opinion, is madness.
The first two-handed bowler I ever saw was Osku Palermaa, from Finland, as he competed on a PBA telecast in 2006. He had a very different style, and though not winning his match, it was obvious how much power he generated using both hands to deliver the ball.
During the telecast there was a brief mention that he had a bad back, and because of the injury he had not been able to bowl for a period of time. The announcers didn’t say how he hurt his back, but with the two-handed delivery, I am sure any back discomfort was magnified. In fact, his two-handed style may have been the root cause of the bad back.
The primary reason for my opposition to the two-handed bowling style is the risk of injury. Even if the bowler does not injure the lower back and/or spine after many years of bowling with a two handed style, the bowler will have such an imbalance in the lower back muscles that
surround the spine that problems will likely surface later into adult life.
How many golfers have bad backs? Many. The golf swing is very similar to the two handed bowling style. The golfer turns his/her back to face down the target line and then turns back to face the target line as they swing the club. The two- handed bowler may not make as dramatic a backward turn, but will rotate and uncoil as they deliver a ball that weighs anywhere from 6-16 pounds (a golf club weighs less than two pounds). This coiling and uncoiling places a tremendous stress on the bowler’s lower back and spine.
I am not a doctor or medical expert, so I decided to investigate. I consulted a licensed chiropractor and a rehabilitation specialist about the two-handed delivery.
Here’s what they had to say: The chiropractor, Dr. Jennifer Riker, D.C., was certain that there was a high likelihood that bowling with this style of delivery would lead to lower back problems. The rehabilitation therapist, said that in her opinion, problems would really show up in the 40-60 year age groups for those who utilize this unusual and unnatural style of
bowling.

What do we want?

We want bowlers to enjoy our great game for a long, long time. What is the bowling ‘life span’ of the two-handed bowler? We have no idea; they have not been around long enough. In my opinion, it is a bowling style that our industry should not encourage.
To illustrate my point we have all enjoyed fireworks displays - as the rockets and mini-missiles fly high into the sky and then burst into a thousand free falling diamonds, emeralds and rubies...WOW! How beautiful and exciting. But all too quickly it’s over, and they are reduced
to nothing but lingering smoke and smoldering ashes.
There is another concern I have in regard to teaching this to youngsters in our youth leagues across the country. One of the accepted ways to determine what weight ball a youth bowler should use is by taking 10% of their body weight. For example, if the youth weighs 80 pounds, then an 8- pound ball would be a good weight to try.
My concern? What happens when a child uses two hands to hold and go to the line and roll the ball? It seems to me that the natural tendency would be to have the child use a heavier ball because they are holding it with both hands. So now, using a heavier ball (maybe 9 or 10 pounds) and using the two-handed style...the young bowler’s muscle and skeletal structure will be placed under greater, and unnecessary stress.
As a bowling instructor, I challenge the educational experts at the highest level of our industry to study the two-handed style. I urge them to get several medical opinions before getting too ‘proactive’ and suggesting it as the ‘new and improved’ way to bowl. Until I hear from qualified and respected back specialists that there is no fear of long-term damage to muscles or the lower spine, I will continue to teach the more traditional and proven bowling style.
However, I did see a two-handed bowler the other day that I approve of. Lots of revs, fair amount of accuracy, a little slow, and not a great deal of pin action. Of course, she was only five years old and she rolled the ball with both hands...underhand; one hand on each side of the ball; while standing at the foul line. I would expect to see her bowl for many years to come...happy and HEALTHY.
On A Roll by Bob Rea

_________________
SomNerve

"Today's scientists have substituted mathematics for experiments, and they wander off through equation after equation, and eventually build a structure which has no relation to reality."
~ Nikola Tesla~

I share his concern about injury and one sided muscle developement.
And this in my oppinion is exactly why its so important to teach coaches about it.
Two handed bowling has found its way into the bowling world and wont leave it as long as there are Pros successful with it.

So guidance is the safest way to ensure that youth bowlers develope a feel for the techniques as well as for the necessity for proper core training these athletes follow.



Also I dont think this is a problem only concerning the two handed bowling.
If Joe Slowinski is successful with his DYDS, then many bowlers will bend as deep as Mike Fagan does. While this is a great technique (Joe usually knows what hes talking about) is has quite the similarity to two handed bowling.

So to me the punchline is: Knowledge is power and needed for better health!

_________________
~ Frerk


"Obviously you're not a golfer" (The Dude)

Two handed bowling has been around for decades. I know Chuck Lande was doing it back in the late 70' and early 80's. It is also my understanding that Chuck also has back issues. I think that the USBC testing center needs to do a lot of evaluation on this subject. While it is highly effective for some people it can be very very dangerous. It can put tremendous strain on certain muscle groups. Many bowlers may want to use this style but it may be physically impossible. There are groups promoting this type of bowling as new and innovative. It is not and it does have a history to go along with it.

Robert

_________________
USBC Bowling Silver Coach, Dick Ritger Level 1 & 2 Instructor, USBC Level 1 Coach Instructor, ASEP Coaching Principles, IBPSIA Certified Technician, USBC Fundamentals of Team Coaching Certified, USBC Athlete Development Drills Certified

This is just one average Joe's opinion. Bob Rea has been teaching bowling for a long time.
He taught me back in the 80's during a Ritger camp. He cautioned me not to quit my day job!
You can see that he had a point



I have a lot of respect for him and his opinions. He has done a lot of good for bowlng and his students!


There will be people on both sides of the fence on this.
That is a good thing because that implies that greater caution and scrutiny will be applied.

I suspect that the data pool is a little shallow so there's not a lot of empirical evidence out there. Scientific study in real life situations with real life people.

Karate can be hazardous to a practitioner, but we have not stopped that ...

All sports carry a risk of wear and tear and injury. Things like luck, flawed technique, physiology, poor training habits, nutrition etc weigh in.

The first 2 hander I ever saw was Chuck Lande, http://www.pba.com/home/search and that was back in the 80's. He was bowling in the qualifiers in a PBA event in Phoenix Az.
He's not a full timer, but he still bowls.
Since he's walked the walk for a few decades, I'd like to hear his opinions.

Important elements will be learning proper technique, achieving and maintaining physical fitness.

Frerk, you had asked about trying the 2 handed style and one of my caveats was using light equipment to start. Another element of training is slow movement to practice the motions, the use of props and so on.

I know from reading this forum that neither Mo nor Jim are opponents of the style. While neither are doctors, their opinions are educated and experience.

The last time I bowled I was about 56 and I was experimenting with the two handed style as I had bowled some 1 handed thumbless earlier. Granted I did not bowl PBA or a lot of games.
My work schedule precluded practice time
I stopped bowling due to an episode with the Big C and Chemo, major paradigm shift at work and schedule. I've never gotten back to it.

Some people are built for certain things. Belmo bowled in the cradle, he looks to be in great shape (he's a multi sport athlete, see a pattern).

Oscu also throws 1 handed at spares at warp speed, there's no reason why that could not be the root of his back problems, or carrying a heavy Christmas tree (which is how I hurt my back - when I shifted the tree during my trek)

Amelleto Moncelli has a pretty radical style and he's bowling Sr PBA now. He's also a multisport athlete.

Sporting injury, wear and tear may very well be a bigger risk for the weekend warrior and not the dedicated sporting athlete who treats him/her/self as an athlete and respects the task at hand.

_________________
"There are many worlds out there. Some of them can be accessed through reading.
Encourage kids to read" - T.A. Sankar


John

Bowling by nature, or any sport that requires a lot of torque through the torso, will create a lot of tension in the lower back. How much tension will be a result of technique and conditioning of the athlete involved. Tennis, Golf, Volleyball, Baseball, Cricket and many other sports, encourage the over development of one side of the body versus the other.

In my 8 years of competitive club level volleyball, I noticed a much more pronounced development of the muscles on the right side of my body, particularly in the muscles surrounding my shoulder. So, as I got more serious about the sport and realized the imbalances and instabilities I was creating, I began to ensure that I was working both sides of my body when I hit the gym. I've found the same thing to be true since taking up bowling. My left knee and hip are much more developed than my right knee and hip, and my right shoulder is much more developed than the left. The same is true of my right forearm. I believe Norm Duke's right forearm is a full inch thicker than his left.

Two handed bowling will definitely put different stresses on the body, but bowling puts a lot stress on specific points of the body already, namely the lower back (even the bowler who stays as square as possible with utilize some level of trunk rotation), the slide side knee and hip (this is true of all bowlers, two handed or otherwise), as well as fingers and wrist of the bowling hand (again, this is true for all bowlers). Ultimately, technique and the strength of the athlete will determine the likelihood and severity of any injuries that occur.

_________________
Father, Husband, Bowler, Web developer



15lb Morich DestroyR
15lb Morich Perpetual Motion
15lb Morich Craze
15lb MoRich Frenzy
15lb MoRich Mojave

Highest score: 276
Highest series: 733

Quote:

Kelly wrote: I began to ensure that I was working both sides of my body when I hit the gym.

A very key point. You are cross training, endeavoring to improve your fitness, strength, flexibility.

There's also another reason to train the other side of the body not only at the gym but during daily endeavors. Doing so may very well have a positive effect on your cognitive health.
You'll develop neural paths and have a back up system for your favored side.
It's like a sword that has two sharp edges instead of one.

Develop the whole body, the whole mind as best you can.

_________________
"There are many worlds out there. Some of them can be accessed through reading.
Encourage kids to read" - T.A. Sankar


John

Ongoing gathering opinions.

Two-Handed Delivery: Analyzing a New Technique
Monday, May 26, 2008
By Thomas D. McKeon Jr., D.C. , Official Chiropractor of the Kegel Training Center
http://www.kegeltrainingcenter.com/V2/f ... KodYazi=12

Wall Street Journal 2009 - see coaches concerns
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB123379401410650043.html

Readers respond to Dick Evans' column about possible danger for youngsters using a two-handed delivery
http://www.bowlingdigital.com/bowl/node/3986

_________________
"There are many worlds out there. Some of them can be accessed through reading.
Encourage kids to read" - T.A. Sankar


John

Is it [url][/url]a fad or a revolution.A little extra to think about.http://www.mentalfloss.com/blogs/archives/24137

_________________
SomNerve

"Today's scientists have substituted mathematics for experiments, and they wander off through equation after equation, and eventually build a structure which has no relation to reality."
~ Nikola Tesla~

I sent a request to Joe Cerar to consider this topic for podcast at above180.com

Speak with two handed bowlers and sports medicine professionals (doctors, trainers).

This is a good topic. It can reinforce the importance of overall fitness no matter the style or sport.

Education/ research and application of "good sense" are paramount. I no longer use the term "Common Sense"

_________________
"There are many worlds out there. Some of them can be accessed through reading.
Encourage kids to read" - T.A. Sankar


John

In the past very little was thought of as far as fitness and nutrition in the sport of bowling. To many, exercise was how many 12oz curls you could do and how many fat burgers you could put away. Seems the more knowledge we acquire the more injuries we get. Modern technology may or may not have something to do with it. 40 years ago I do not remember anyone having slide issues. Knee problems were around but nothing like what it is now. Approaches of all types seem to cause problems. I think shoes have a lot to do with it also. If you were sore you took a shower and an aspirin. No one that I knew stretched out before bowling little lone did jumping jacks and other exercises they want us to do now. 300 pound Billy Bob back then may have been a decent bowler. Now we worry about body structures and build types. I still have no idea why they measure vertical leaping ability for a bowler but maybe someday it will make perfect sense. Diets and nutrition I can understand. We even had a guy bowl backwards at nationals a few years ago and did fairly well. I think the facts are the game will always change and bowlers and coaches need to be aware of the effects and any risk that may be involved. I remember my Silver exam with Rod Ross. He had me analyze a bowler's video. He was wearing skin tight wrangler jeans with a huge belt buckle and long sleeve flannel shirt. He had a 10 gallon hat that could have been maybe a 12 gallon one. The man took an 8 step approach and on the sixth step became airborne. His release looked like he was throwing a sack of potatoes into the back of a pickup truck. Rod said what do you do. My answer was try to keep him from becoming airborne. Rod said "good he averages 240 in California!". There are probably a half dozen things that are not right or unhealthy in that description. Some need attention, some need improvement and some need to be just left alone. Bowlers and coaches need to know what needs attention, improvement and left alone.

Robert

_________________
USBC Bowling Silver Coach, Dick Ritger Level 1 & 2 Instructor, USBC Level 1 Coach Instructor, ASEP Coaching Principles, IBPSIA Certified Technician, USBC Fundamentals of Team Coaching Certified, USBC Athlete Development Drills Certified

That's (what to change what to leave alone)probably one of the most cogent admonitions that Tom Kouros made in his "Par Bowling ..." book.
That is perhaps one of the most important traits a coach/instructor can have. In fact it's one of the most important things period!

Since I mentioned Kouros, 5 people posted a rating for his book. Well at least they are all top scores as are the 10 at amazon ...

I'm of the opinion that if one were to fully comprehend his text and master it, they would indeed be a top notch instructor.

Search 123xyz to see results of the polls of that ilk.

_________________
"There are many worlds out there. Some of them can be accessed through reading.
Encourage kids to read" - T.A. Sankar


John

Thank you for the post Coolerman. I am not a doctor but I do believe we need a lot of research on this topic before we can offically or unoffically endorse this style. Two handed bowling has been around for at least 25 years and I bowled with a two handed bowler, Danny Nicholson, who was a scratch player in the mid -late 1980s. I am not against it but I am very leary of it. I would NOT encourage it unless the bowler researched it. Ron Hoppe has given me some pointers on coaching two handed bowling but again I do not advocate it.But it is an alternative.

Is it successful? Well we seem to have only two bowlers who have really emerged as being highly successful with this style so maybe it is not advantageous as one would be lead to believe. The two handed "revolution" has not occurred as predicted by some but maybe it will. Do not forget Jason B has a degree in marketing and he certainly knows how to market himself and the PBA and USBC, in desperation, were sold a bill of marketing goods and bit the marketing campaign in an attempt to do anything to get "the ratings up".
While the "two handed revolution" has not come about (yet), I do expect it to be around as an alternative style. Remember "thumbless bowling" was suppose to become dominant as well but....

Marketing can be a catylst for infomation that is sound and positive but it can misinform as well. Seek out the medical evidence. Weigh up the pros and con. Make a rational decsion. No more can be asked from an authentic person.

_________________
-Gary Parsons
If one does not know one's product, one can not manage nor promote the product one does not know.

There is little doubt that the great diversity of styles and techniques of bowlers from countries has helped to shape the history of bowling. With the recent world-wide implementation of professional coaching schemes, which generally teach only one, or perhaps two optimal ways of delivering a ball, bowling could be in danger of losing its technical diversity. Are we therefore on the verge of a new era in which the sport of bowling is irretrievably lost? Possibly!

It is evident then that the physics and biomechanics of bowling is immensely complex, and not fully understood. Some coaches believe that the mechanics of bowling is relatively simple. However, a proper understanding of the biomechanical principles underlying bowling is still not completely understood.

_________________
SomNerve

"Today's scientists have substituted mathematics for experiments, and they wander off through equation after equation, and eventually build a structure which has no relation to reality."
~ Nikola Tesla~

It seems to me that most, if not all of the high level coaches categorically agree about the optimal way to deliver the ball: bowling side shoulder lowered, ball directly under the head and the arm swing down the intended target line. The points of disagreement come about when discussing how to get the athlete to the line in that position as efficiently as possible.

There is such a huge variety of delivery styles (two hand vs one hand, thumb vs half-thumb vs no-thumb and all the variations and permutations of each) and grip styles (full finger tip, semi-finger tip, conventional, sarge easter, pinky holes), I personally think it ultimately comes down to biomechanical efficiency. Some people naturally have very good biomechanics, while others have to really work at it to get greater efficiency in motion.

There is a kid in California called Matt Jones who has the "ugliest" form known to man. However, he is one of the premier teen bowlers out that way, I believe, having won several JBT tournaments and several honor scores to his name. NO ONE in their right mind would coach anyone to bowl the way he does and yet he makes it work.

_________________
Father, Husband, Bowler, Web developer



15lb Morich DestroyR
15lb Morich Perpetual Motion
15lb Morich Craze
15lb MoRich Frenzy
15lb MoRich Mojave

Highest score: 276
Highest series: 733

So much for cookie cutter coaching! It goes back to the old saying," it's not how pretty it is how many".

Robert

_________________
USBC Bowling Silver Coach, Dick Ritger Level 1 & 2 Instructor, USBC Level 1 Coach Instructor, ASEP Coaching Principles, IBPSIA Certified Technician, USBC Fundamentals of Team Coaching Certified, USBC Athlete Development Drills Certified

While it can't be argued that the guy has somehow developed a way to get it done, I can't help thinking many finger problems in the future as he grows older and his body matures. I respect anyone that can make a style work but when his body can no longer do it:
1. Will he continue in the sport
2. How hard would it be to convert his style to get him still bowling big scores.

_________________
PAP 41/2 over by 5/8 up
Axis tilt 13*
Axis Rotation 70*
Speed of the hand 17.6 Mph
Revs 250rpm

Benchmarks as per Mo
Asym 55/4/35
Sym 60/3 1/4/30

This is what makes bowling coaching interesting. Who says that you have to bowl the same way at age 20 as you will at age 80? While we as coaches have proven systems that will improve most bowlers, every once in a while someone innovative or different shows up and changes the sport. Mark Roth comes to mind. Inventions come about that also greatly effect the sport. Bowling shoes, reactive resin balls, etc. Pro shop techniques like the finger tip grip become the norm.

A few years ago I was asked to bowl for some one that was injured in a youth adult league. I said ok and showed up to bowl. During that period of time coaches were told to discourage a technique called the run and dump. Many little kids did this instead of learning how to swing the ball. There was a 7 year old boy named Max that everyone warned me about. Max was a run and dumper but would shoot 180 at you without a thought. He looked as if he was landing on an aircraft carrier with a loud bang. Should Dexter rush out and start making interchangeable knee pads? I don't think so but what if the young man in the video is the evolution of the run and dump?

The next problem.... Here you have a kid that just shot 18 in a row. What does he average? Let say he is a 200 average bowler. How and why do you convert a 200 average bowler into a 140 average bowler to get them back to 200. Many parents will think you are from outer space and you had better produce results. To me the reason had either be to advance in average, consistency or to eliminate the possibility of injury. Not because he doesn't look like someones vision of what a bowler should look like.

Even with the form as he has it now is this young man still able to be coached? You betcha! The coach needs to be opened minded and understand how he works. Once that is done things can progress.

Robert

_________________
USBC Bowling Silver Coach, Dick Ritger Level 1 & 2 Instructor, USBC Level 1 Coach Instructor, ASEP Coaching Principles, IBPSIA Certified Technician, USBC Fundamentals of Team Coaching Certified, USBC Athlete Development Drills Certified

i think there are a lot of old time bowlers that have passed on , "rolling in their graves" when they see belmo coming on to bowl. i know myself,that when he is in a tournament, i usually turn the channel becuase i just don't care for that style of bowling. when i watch some of the older bowlers bowl,it's like and art form when they bowl but when belmo comes on, it's a whole different style of bowling. what would be the difference between a bowler that throws the ball over his head or under his legs then? i watched this matt jones video and i said to myself"wtf" is he doing ,is this some kind of joke on bowlers all over the world? that's my opinion.