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 Post subject: Wrist Device Usage to Cut Rpms - your opinion
 Posted: Tue Jan 08, 2019 8:17 pm Post Number: #1 Post
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Submitted as a possible solution.
What is your experience and opinion?
Juha Maha had commented that wrist devices were "REV killers".

As noted, today's game places a premium on ball speed.
Bowler's can be Rev Dominant for a variety of reasons. For those who cannot increase ball speed due to physical constraints ...
One possible solution might be wearing a wrist device to "kill" revs.
Not the manufacturers intent, but given that wrist devices "lock" the wrist and hand, that
design will place a range on rpms.

What are your thoughts.

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 Post subject: Re: Wrist Device Usage to Cut Rpms - your opinion
 Posted: Tue Jan 08, 2019 11:04 pm Post Number: #2 Post
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From my own experience I agree.

I used to wear a wrist device. I thought it was enabling me to roll a heavier ball. The weakest link ended up being my shoulder. I shed the device when I went to lighter weight equipment. My rev rate increased and continued to increase until I became a rev dominant bowler. Rev dominant to a point that now I struggle keeping the ball speed high enough to keep the ball right of the head pin.
This year I have made a concerted effort to play with more speed and take the hand out of it.
I have seriously considered going back to the brace then I have a good night keeping the ball speed up for all 3 games and score well and I put that thought on the back burner.

I know another bowler that wears one because when he doesn't wear it he says "my balls hook too much."

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 Post subject: Re: Wrist Device Usage to Cut Rpms - your opinion
 Posted: Tue Jan 08, 2019 11:57 pm Post Number: #3 Post
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A lot depends on where you are coming from. If you are a Super Senior, below 200 avg bowler, you might look at some of the mature women pros, Liz Johnson, Shannon O’Keefe, Lynda Barnes, Robin Romeo etc. They are far better bowlers than almost all of us could ever even dream of being, they use some pretty heavy duty wrist supports by choice

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 Post subject: Re: Wrist Device Usage to Cut Rpms - your opinion
 Posted: Wed Jan 09, 2019 12:42 am Post Number: #4 Post
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davidjr113 wrote:
A lot depends on where you are coming from. If you are a Super Senior, below 200 avg bowler, you might look at some of the mature women pros, Liz Johnson, Shannon O’Keefe, Lynda Barnes, Robin Romeo etc. They are far better bowlers than almost all of us could ever even dream of being, they use some pretty heavy duty wrist supports by choice

By choice, they are getting paid to wear them. It is advertising for the manufacturers.
I am not saying that they don't benefit from the use but I have to believe Sponsorship has something to do with the decision.

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 Post subject: Re: Wrist Device Usage to Cut Rpms - your opinion
 Posted: Wed Jan 09, 2019 1:18 am Post Number: #5 Post
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Since you first posted this thought as a result of my post, I might as well chime in. I worked very hard, not only to increase revs, but to learn to adjust my axis tilt and rotation. A wrist brace kills this capability. Why would I want to intentionally decrease my rev rate, rather than finding a ball this allows me to function despite my rev dominance? I really don't get it at all!


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 Post subject: Re: Wrist Device Usage to Cut Rpms - your opinion
 Posted: Wed Jan 09, 2019 1:20 am Post Number: #6 Post
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Seriously, Eric?

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 Post subject: Re: Wrist Device Usage to Cut Rpms - your opinion
 Posted: Wed Jan 09, 2019 2:34 am Post Number: #7 Post
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Wrist supports, compression sleeves, kinesio tape, shoes, shirts and balls, all with logo's on them.
At that level it is all about advertising and getting product seen.

I saw an interview where a bowler was asked about wearing a wrist support glove, the response was basically for this tournament his sponsor wanted him to wear it. He did but removed the metal support piece from it so basically he was just wearing the company logo on the glove.

If a professional is not getting paid for using products on TV then shame on them.

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 Post subject: Re: Wrist Device Usage to Cut Rpms - your opinion
 Posted: Wed Jan 09, 2019 3:19 pm Post Number: #8 Post
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If you have the ability to cup, then uncup your wrist, then a wrist brace will decrease rev rates. For an old guy like me a Robby Revs helps to keep my fingers under the ball and increases my revs from 175 to 225.

I have tried the modern release but it's difficult to learn without a coach.


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 Post subject: Re: Wrist Device Usage to Cut Rpms - your opinion
 Posted: Wed Jan 09, 2019 5:22 pm Post Number: #9 Post
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For me, it's a wrist injury. Without it, I can get MAYBE 8 frames in before I can't deliver the ball, period, without feeling like an ice pick is being jammed into my wrist. Yes, there's a surgery I can do to fix it, but the only thing that aggravates it is bowling, and the recovery (which I did on my left wrist - same injury) was in a cast for 6 weeks and then in a splint plus therapy for 6 more. . . and I'm SO right-dominant that I can't write, type, or do other very necessary things (LOL) with my left hand. . . so that's out of the picture!

And, since there's that injury, which is decades old now and I doubt reparable anymore, I can't get hardly any revs on the ball without the brace (Storm Gadget - kept in a VERY neutral position)


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 Post subject: Re: Wrist Device Usage to Cut Rpms - your opinion
 Posted: Wed Jan 09, 2019 8:18 pm Post Number: #10 Post
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Unsure why all the anti-wrist support posts come from but I have used various supports over the years as I have an old hockey injury. I honestly am of the opinion that various PWBA players use them because they need to not because of a contract for more money. I can't remember when Liz Johnson, Shannon O'Keefe, Stefanie Johnson have not used some sort of support their whole careers even before they became great.

What supports tend to do is promote a more staying under the ball. Personalty I am all for that particular factor.

As to the OP's question I'd say they don't necessarily cut down on revs unless you are asking the modern yo-yo release which one can not do with a support on. For the majority of seniors, ladies etc this kind of yo-yo release is nearly impossible to replicate nor would I advise it with less than better wrist strength.


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 Post subject: Re: Wrist Device Usage to Cut Rpms - your opinion
 Posted: Sat Jan 12, 2019 10:11 pm Post Number: #11 Post
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A change in pitches may help de rev a player. Depends on technique but more reverse in the fingers sometimes does the trick. A different wrist position, less cupped will decrease revs.


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 Post subject: Re: Wrist Device Usage to Cut Rpms - your opinion
 Posted: Sun Jan 13, 2019 1:16 am Post Number: #12 Post
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kajmk wrote:
Submitted as a possible solution.
What is your experience and opinion?
Juha Maha had commented that wrist devices were "REV killers".

What are your thoughts.


Many years ago, my sister (who is a Physical therapist) gave me a "medical wrist support" after I had developed tendinitis.

I found that I bowled better with it . In addition to shortening my span on my bowling balls - I progressed through several wrist supports. They are not the same. I bowl with the wrist supports. It works great for me. In fact, when I bowl without it, my wrist often hurts.

It limits wrist snap but you can get some that are reasonable " flexible". I doubt if I were a "pro bowler" I would use one. But I bowled with and without them. I find bowling with them is far superior in most aspects of the game. Lot's of adjusting the dial but the consistency of the hand far outweighs everything else - IMHO ( as a recreational bowler)

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 Post subject: Re: Wrist Device Usage to Cut Rpms - your opinion
 Posted: Sun Jan 20, 2019 6:58 am Post Number: #13 Post
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Everyone I've spoken to about this says that wrist devices have added revs to their game.


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 Post subject: Re: Wrist Device Usage to Cut Rpms - your opinion
 Posted: Wed Jan 23, 2019 10:53 pm Post Number: #14 Post
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RobMautner wrote:
Since you first posted this thought as a result of my post, I might as well chime in. I worked very hard, not only to increase revs, but to learn to adjust my axis tilt and rotation. A wrist brace kills this capability. Why would I want to intentionally decrease my rev rate, rather than finding a ball this allows me to function despite my rev dominance? I really don't get it at all!



You can do all of that if you don't turn the brace up to the hilt and allow some freedom of the hand (flexion/extension) and some of the fingers

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 Post subject: Re: Wrist Device Usage to Cut Rpms - your opinion
 Posted: Fri Jan 25, 2019 4:42 pm Post Number: #15 Post
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Wrist devices are definitely designed to provide help to a bowler, "some" have worn them to tame the whippet wrists. I personally know of one who wore a cobra back in the urethane era. Yes he could actually apply more stuff to the ball without than with.
Most of us do not have that "problem". That bowler passed away a few years ago.

Question, would a Robert Smith, a Tommy Jones, EJ Tackett, increase or decrease their rpms
by strapping on a wrist support.

As Dax explained, the RPMs come from wrist "movement".
This is analogous to a yo-yo or Frisbee action.

Watch the ETBF video and listen to Juha Maha.

Norm Duke and Bill Hall and Juha Maha and others advise an individual first establishi a bona fide need for the devices before assuming they need one.

These are aides that many need and prefer, it's a matter of choice.
They are legal, but you'll note that to date, none have been engineered to actually add movement. I believe doing so would be contrary to rules.

Again, this is not meant to be a disparaging or pejorative statement.
Most if not all of my posts are an attempt to be helpful.
I try to post sources and references as few thoughts or gambits are purely original.

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There should be a rule of war saying you have to see someone up close and get to know 'em before it's ok to shoot 'em.

Desiderata

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