Ajusting.... Learn Something

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RobMautner
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Ajusting.... Learn Something

Post by RobMautner » August 26th, 2018, 1:41 am

I just got done watching the PWBA Players Championship. If you doubt that you have to adjust based on what other players on the lane are doing, watch this Tournament.

Game 1: Jordan Richard played in, Lindsay Boomershine played out. Jordan won by a lot. Game 1: Kelly Kulick played left of Jordan Richard. Kelly won by a lot. Game 3: Danielle McKuen played significantly right of Kelly (Danielle has a really bad habit of deciding where she is going to play before she starts). Danielle got trounced. Game 4: Kelly and Stepanie Johnson were playing the lanes the same. Stephanie was able to increase her ball speed while Kelly had to try to play in front of the ball return on the right lane. Stephanie won in a very good match.

Moral of the story: Learn to play where you are uncomfortable on the lane. If you practice it, before you know it, you'll be able to do it, and never again will you refer to "where I like to play the lanes," which drives me ABSOLUTELY NUTS!

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Re: Ajusting.... Learn Something

Post by 44boyd » August 26th, 2018, 1:54 am

Jordan Richard is a beast, I like how she rolls it a lot.
Stacy

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Re: Ajusting.... Learn Something

Post by MegaMav » August 26th, 2018, 2:43 am

The past couple of tournaments have featured patterns that are favorable from outside of 5, a Hoagland signature.
Yet, on the telecasts that avenue is abandoned regularly, I dont get it.

Kulick is the most versatile, Johnson the least.
Sometimes I wonder if playing super deep is worth the lack of carry from giving up so much angle to the pocket.
When bowling and find myself left of 22-23 at the arrows, I start thinking about moving back right and playing in the OB.
Non-house shot of course.
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Re: Ajusting.... Learn Something

Post by GrumpyCatFace » August 26th, 2018, 6:27 am

MegaMav wrote:The past couple of tournaments have featured patterns that are favorable from outside of 5, a Hoagland signature.
Yet, on the telecasts that avenue is abandoned regularly, I dont get it.

Kulick is the most versatile, Johnson the least.
Sometimes I wonder if playing super deep is worth the lack of carry from giving up so much angle to the pocket.
When bowling and find myself left of 22-23 at the arrows, I start thinking about moving back right and playing in the OB.
Non-house shot of course.
I’m struggling to understand this as well. How can it be an advantage playing way inside, and essentially losing most of the speed, hoping to hook it in? Wouldn’t it be more desirable to just increase speed and stay put?

I typically play on board 20-25, aiming at second arrow or so. I know I’m no pro, but it seems more consistent.

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Re: Ajusting.... Learn Something

Post by RobMautner » August 26th, 2018, 11:42 am

While it's been some time since I last spoke to Kelly, I seem to remember her telling me that one of the things that she had to improve to compete on the Men's Tour was standing in front of the ball return. I'm afraid that the PWBA doesn't afford her enough opportunity to practice this. I agree that learning to increase ball speed is a good alternative, as demonstrated by Stephanie Johnson. I would also like to point out that it allowed her to play right of 25, not 10 board!

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Re: Ajusting.... Learn Something

Post by MegaMav » August 26th, 2018, 12:08 pm

RobMautner wrote: I'm afraid that the PWBA doesn't afford her enough opportunity to practice this.
What makes you think she doesnt practice this on her own time or in other events?
She wouldnt be doing it on TV if she wasnt comfortable doing it and think it was the best chance to win.
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Re: Ajusting.... Learn Something

Post by TomaHawk » August 27th, 2018, 2:16 pm

There are comfort zones for each and every bowler. Being able to throw a few shots outside of that comfort zone may be necessary for a pro level bowler. But, to insinuate that all people who roll a bowling ball should be able to move from Zone A to Zone Z is erroneous. Hardly anyone, except Team USA members or someone who works in a center, has that much time to practice.

It gets tiresome reading material that is not pertinent to the average bowler.

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Re: Ajusting.... Learn Something

Post by MegaMav » August 27th, 2018, 2:53 pm

TomaHawk wrote:There are comfort zones for each and every bowler. Being able to throw a few shots outside of that comfort zone may be necessary for a pro level bowler. But, to insinuate that all people who roll a bowling ball should be able to move from Zone A to Zone Z is erroneous. Hardly anyone, except Team USA members or someone who works in a center, has that much time to practice.

It gets tiresome reading material that is not pertinent to the average bowler.
One thing hasnt changed, in any well executed form of sport it takes dedication and repetition to perform at a high level.
Bowlers are losing that now because of attitudes like the above quoted.
Its too bad. Some of us are dedicated to expanding our skill set to be prepared to attack any condition only to be dragged down by the excuse making crowd that can only perform on one... sometimes.
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Re: Ajusting.... Learn Something

Post by TomaHawk » August 27th, 2018, 4:48 pm

MegaMav wrote:
One thing hasnt changed, in any well executed form of sport it takes dedication and repetition to perform at a high level.
Bowlers are losing that now because of attitudes like the above quoted.
Its too bad. Some of us are dedicated to expanding our skill set to be prepared to attack any condition only to be dragged down by the excuse making crowd that can only perform on one... sometimes.
Bowling is no different than any other sport. Like in baseball, you can either hit a fastball or you can't. Professional hitters make a living off hitting 90+mph fastballs. Everyday, ordinary people would be hard pressed to get the bat off their shoulder before the ball hit the catcher's glove. Some would say, well, you just need a little practice.

What if it was shooting a basketball?

A lot of professional basketball players can easily knock down a 16 foot shot. The percentages go down when they are moved back to the three point line. Just a couple of feet makes all the difference for a lot of reasons, but most importantly, it is involves the strength factor.

There are, let me clarify that, there used to be a lot of people who enjoyed organized bowling. But, people are not prone to wanting to do something that only gives them little or no satisfaction. Now, let's multiply that times 36 weeks.

Suggesting that people take the time out of their life to do something they are (probably) never going to be physically capable of accomplishing is a lesson in futility. One would think, bowling would have learned that lesson by now.
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Re: Ajusting.... Learn Something

Post by spmcgivern » August 27th, 2018, 5:42 pm

MegaMav wrote:
One thing hasnt changed, in any well executed form of sport it takes dedication and repetition to perform at a high level.
Bowlers are losing that now because of attitudes like the above quoted.
Its too bad. Some of us are dedicated to expanding our skill set to be prepared to attack any condition only to be dragged down by the excuse making crowd that can only perform on one... sometimes.
Can you explain your opinion on what performing at a high level means? Should everyone be of the same opinion?

My opinion is I compete at a high level, but not at the highest level. I just moved to a new city and I have the ability to maintain the high average for this center. Does that automatically mean I am performing at a high level? I couldn't do this in my last center. And I know I won't be trying to improve on my game to compete on shots I will never see in a league setting. There is no reason to.

And guess what, the sport of bowling will not be ruined because I decided not to practice playing the twig or left of 25 when I will not be required to anytime in the near future. I don't have that much clout and neither does anyone else.

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Re: Ajusting.... Learn Something

Post by MegaMav » August 27th, 2018, 6:32 pm

spmcgivern wrote:
Can you explain your opinion on what performing at a high level means?
High level doesnt mean league bowling on a house shot, sorry.
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Re: Ajusting.... Learn Something

Post by Bahshay » August 27th, 2018, 7:51 pm

MegaMav wrote:
One thing hasnt changed, in any well executed form of sport it takes dedication and repetition to perform at a high level.
Bowlers are losing that now because of attitudes like the above quoted.
Its too bad. Some of us are dedicated to expanding our skill set to be prepared to attack any condition only to be dragged down by the excuse making crowd that can only perform on one... sometimes.
So how did you do at nationals this year? The bowlers journal? Your local regionals? All signed up for the bud light challenge? Lots of good tournaments in NY this year to shoe up with the non-excuse making crowd.
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Re: Ajusting.... Learn Something

Post by spmcgivern » August 27th, 2018, 8:18 pm

MegaMav wrote:
High level doesnt mean league bowling on a house shot, sorry.
I didn't realize the oil pattern or the competitive setting dictated how skilled a bowler is.

You still didn't explain your opinion on what high level is.

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Re: Ajusting.... Learn Something

Post by MegaMav » August 27th, 2018, 9:52 pm

spmcgivern wrote: You still didn't explain your opinion on what high level is.
A participant who has refined their skill of bowling to the point where they are able to adjust to nearly any particular situation and score higher than most. Thats about as succinct as I can make it without making this post a mile long regarding ball motion, touch, intelligence, intuition, etc.

There is no honor bowling on house shots. The technology has far outmatched the current minimum conditioning specs. Its like mowing your lawn with a nuclear weapon.

Before you get into the "but house shots..." argument, save it, house shots are purely recreational as far as I'm concerned and no different from 1 man ping pong. Very little skill involved.

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Bahshay wrote: So how did you do at nationals this year? The bowlers journal? Your local regionals? All signed up for the bud light challenge? Lots of good tournaments in NY this year to shoe up with the non-excuse making crowd.
Tough being hurt with a first dorsal compartment injury, when I was bowling a tournament in October.
I was on a team, but had to withdraw from Nationals. Toughest phone call I've had to make in a long time.
Trying to bowl again now, wrist is still clicking and crunching though. MRI on showed osteo arthritis in Radioulnar joint.
I run a challenge league here, hoping to start with that soon.
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Re: Ajusting.... Learn Something

Post by stevespo » August 27th, 2018, 10:05 pm

As I've said many times, I have great respect for the pros (ladies and men) - yet I'm often scratching my head during these telecasts trying to understand their thought process. It's often looks very different during qualifying or matchplay.

Those stepladders seem to create so much stress and discomfort, I can't blame them for temporary insanity - effectively dealing with the pressure is what makes champions. I suspect most of us have not bowled on TV for a national title. Correct? Locals, state, regionals - perhaps... but not the TV lights, etc.

Stephanie Johnson led the tournament. She was erratic on TV, a couple of Brooklyns, yet she had enough ball speed to keep things in play and carry when it counted. I was hoping Kelly would ball down and stay put, but she chose another route. I certainly can't fault her for it. She's won all over the world and knows what she is capable of and what her comfort level is.

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Re: Ajusting.... Learn Something

Post by MegaMav » August 27th, 2018, 10:34 pm

stevespo wrote: yet I'm often scratching my head during these telecasts trying to understand their thought process. It's often looks very different during qualifying or matchplay.
I'm glad im not the only one, I get text message from other players in the area discussing the same thing.
I have a hard time believing its "the lights". That may show transition faster, but I think there is a panic if they're not striking in practice. The move left of the pattern slope, use a shinier ball to get there and everything goes to hell. Thats how I see it at least.

Ball motion wise, why are so many using fast transitioning balls with shiny finishes on the fresh on TV?
Liz Kuhlkin gave us the blue print for succeeding on a telecast in the US Women's Open. Yet, the next time she was on, it was the same ol' too sharp, too quick, uncontrollable reaction.

I dont get it.
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Re: Ajusting.... Learn Something

Post by spmcgivern » August 28th, 2018, 11:10 am

MegaMav wrote: There is no honor bowling on house shots. The technology has far outmatched the current minimum conditioning specs. Its like mowing your lawn with a nuclear weapon.
Don't you think this is a little uncalled for? Not everyone has unlimited opportunity to bowl on conditions that aren't the dreaded THS. To insinuate their bowling as having no honor is what is wrong with this sport. Get off your high horse.

This discussion is as old as bowling itself. There will always be conditions that are easier than others. If someone bowls on a 6:1 you will complain it isn't 5:1. If they bowl on 3:1 you will complain it isn't U.S. Open. There is no satisfying you when it comes to perceived honor in bowling.

Performing at a high level is possible on every condition. It is possible on THS and it is possible on 1:1 flat conditions. It is dependent on the ability of the bowler to score on the condition in front of them. It has nothing to do with the shot and everything to do with the bowlers ability.
MegaMav wrote: I run a challenge league here, hoping to start with that soon.
Congratulations on getting a challenge league going. Unfortunately no amount of sweet talk and bribery will get something similar where I am currently. There is one bowling center within 80 miles of where I am. I feel they might not be quite up to date considering they still call their junior league YABA and the pro shop advertisements in the center show off the Titanium Boss. The biggest and supposedly most competitive league complained about paying $20 a night and turned down the proposal. Just not the type of place that wants to push the boundaries of challenging patterns.

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