Board index » Coaching Forums » Community Coaching




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 44 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3
Author Message
 Post subject: Re: Can dropping you waist level give more speed and accurac
 Posted: Thu May 04, 2017 3:09 pm Post Number: #41 Post
Offline
Member
User avatar

Joined: January 21, 2017
Posts: 38
Reputation: 1
Reputation Power: 1
Exactly what I see as well.
To give a 'golf' analogy this is the same as the dreaded reverse pivot. A death knell to power, speed & control. Caused by - improper spine angle/tilt. This is a very weak position from which to impart any leverage at all. You are merely 'waving' at it.

So after 40 posts of scientific theory on physics, vector angles, tangent, gravity, momentum etc.,etc. it's all BS!

You have a coach & he doesn't SEE this! Find a new one & fast!


Top 
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Can dropping you waist level give more speed and accurac
 Posted: Thu May 04, 2017 7:11 pm Post Number: #42 Post
Offline
Member

Joined: December 6, 2015
Posts: 89
Location: Finland
Reputation: 18
Reputation Power: 1
2y2 wrote:
Hello LittleTiger, now I see everything clear!

This is a description of some things I see that are going on, I´m not giving any solution whatsoever, I really recommend you to upload recent videos, side and back views for Jimm Merrill to analyze and give you his unparalleled advise.

Yea well I noticed that I should take side view videos more often. I found only couple of them but not any very recent.

Other part of story is that I choose old video for purpose because I remember which kind of things we have practiced after that with my coaches so can compare them to your recommendations :)


2y2 wrote:
Third step: Even though your timing at the 3rd step is almost right your torso is very vertical and you appear to be sitting back all the time. Look at Marshall Kent, how he has forward tilt, you both look similar at that point but his torso is starting to lean forward, yours don´t.

This point I have probably got fixed with shorten first two steps and having forward tilt already on start position.

2y2 wrote:
Top of the swing: You get very early to the top of the swing, here too, you can see how vertical your torso is and how you appear to be sitting back. You haven´t even begun your pivot step and this is the moment when your ball is static and will start to fall, too early. Marshal´s up swing hasn´t finished here and his right foot is already on the floor.

On newer video timing looks be better on this point but keeping forward tilt have been always hard for me. Anyway, that is line with thing what my coach have been telling me that I should focus to keep chest "looking" to floor instead of side. Needs more practice.

2y2 wrote:
Pivot step: this is the moment when your ball should be starting to fall but in your case, it is already shoulder high, you can see how early your timing is and how in Marshal´s case the ball is starting the downswing. Notice Marshal´s forward tilt, compare it to yours, he´s attacking you´re sitting.

Timing on this point too looks to be better on newer videos but do you have good ideas how to get from sitting to attacking on this point?
I see difference on pictures but how to practice that other than just having more forward tilt?

2y2 wrote:
Mark Baker´s timing spot: According to Mark Baker, almost all hall of famers have the same position at this point, Marshall does but you are earlier as you get to the foul line. I´ve overlaid Marshall green lines so you can compare angles better. When your left heel touches the ground, your right arm should be horizontal (Blue line), in your case, well, look at the pink line. Once again compare Marshall´s forward tilt to yours, he´s attacking you´re sitting back.

This timing spot was new for me. Thanks for information. Need to learn more about it.

2y2 wrote:
Release: At this moment you are leaning backwards, you push your hips to the front and pull your back backwards, dissipating all energy from your torso to the ball, you´ve lost the small torso forward tilt you had, compare Marshall´s position, the spine angle is at its greatest, look where his head is compared to his left foot and knee, everything is going forward, he´s attacking, you´re not, look how far away is your face from the vertical yellow line.

Luckily I'm not pull back backwards anymore but learning to not push hips to the front needs more practice. My coach has told me that I should think about push hips backwards/to left on this point which looks helping but it is not easy.

2y2 wrote:
I think that definitely one reason for your low speed starts with your really small forward tilt.

Yes, I agree that is one of the reasons. On this thread I probably was mostly interested about other factors but it is interesting to see how important you see this.

2y2 wrote:
I´m sorry to say this, but I don´t think your waist level has anything to do with your energy transfer.

You are allowed to say that :) I need discuss more with my coach that what he is looking for with that.

Anyway, big thanks for very good video analyze.

imagonman wrote:
Exactly what I see as well.
To give a 'golf' analogy this is the same as the dreaded reverse pivot. A death knell to power, speed & control. Caused by - improper spine angle/tilt. This is a very weak position from which to impart any leverage at all. You are merely 'waving' at it.

There looks to be lot of articles on about "reverse pivot". Thanks for term.

imagonman wrote:
So after 40 posts of scientific theory on physics, vector angles, tangent, gravity, momentum etc.,etc. it's all BS!

You have a coach & he doesn't SEE this! Find a new one & fast!

No all them was not BS. This have been very educational discussion (at least for me). I have not said that dropping waist level/body or practice bowling with sneakers would be only things what my coach have been telling me. These was things what I did not fully understood that why I wanted discuss with you about them.

I'm that kind of person that I need to understand why to be able to learn anything.

I have been practicing with my current coach only just couple of times now and getting more forward tilt and learning to not push hips to the front on point of release are things we have been focusing so he definetily have seen this even when situtation is even not so bad anymore that it has on that two years old video.


Top 
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Can dropping you waist level give more speed and accurac
 Posted: Fri May 05, 2017 1:41 am Post Number: #43 Post
Offline
Member
User avatar

Joined: July 25, 2010
Posts: 315
Location: Queretaro City, Mexico
Reputation: 113
Reputation Power: 2
I think you only need at first to try to keep your head ahead of your feet instead of your butt behind them. When you want to correct something you have to exaggerate the correction for it to be effective.

_________________
If you think I helped, please click on the "+" button, Thanks.


Top 
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Can dropping you waist level give more speed and accurac
 Posted: Sat Aug 12, 2017 9:39 pm Post Number: #44 Post
Offline
Member

Joined: December 6, 2015
Posts: 89
Location: Finland
Reputation: 18
Reputation Power: 1
It has been gone some time and I think that it is time to update status to this topic.
This time I do not ask anything but I want to share my current thinking for you if someone is interested about it.

First of all, my knee is in better shape now and I have been able to practice these things for while now :)


Then what comes to bowling with sneakers I did that for while in practice and actual on couple of competitions too.

What I learned was that with sneakers I definitely get more speed to bowling ball with less effort than with S6 - S9 soles which I have used on my Dexters earlier.
But sneakers also makes releasing on correct time hard... (like you have been saying)

So lately I have been using my Dexters again but now with a combination of S2 sole and H2 heel. Which at least now feels like good compromise to get more speed without mess up release.

And because one picture and tell more than thousand words here is one of my sneakers and my current bowling shoes:
Attachment:
Bowling shoes.png



What comes to dropping waist level it feels also good idea and looks giving me more power to bowling ball.
I don't even try anymore understand why it works but I just wanted share to you latest tips how my coach has helped me to learn how to do it.

My opinion is that this old video from Mark Roth's 7 10 split conversion is best for explaining this and it also tells very important point (what my coach have been also saying for me) that this is not new idea. Pro's have been used it always.

When he wants to put lot of speed to bowling ball he will let his ass drop on free fall just before taking last step:
Attachment:
Mark Roth waist level comparison.png
and then the very important point (which I haven't understood correctly earlier): ass should start dropping exactly on same time with bowling ball, then it will feel like weightless.

I have been able to do this correctly couple of times now and can say that it really works at least for me... ball feels like weightless and power on it is HUGE...


Only problem what I currently have is that it needs a lot of concentration to be able to do this correctly because it is too easy to go back to old style. Luckily there is "simple" solution to this. I just need more practice :lol:


Anyway, this was just short recap where I'm with these things now and hope that these make sense to you too and maybe someone can even found something useful information from this topic.
Lastly, I want to thank you all who have been participating in this topic. I have learned a lot from these conversations.


You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.


Top 
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
 
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 44 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3

Board index » Coaching Forums » Community Coaching


 
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to: