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 Post subject: Clipping Middle Finger Hole and Thumb Hole
 Posted: Wed Aug 18, 2010 9:12 am Post Number: #1 Post
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Alright, So I have been bowling for around 7 years now. For the first 5 years I was throwing a back up ball. I taught myself how to throw a regular hook now. Im right handed.

I averaged 194 last year in league and hoping over 200 this year.

One major problem I have that I can not fix is that, when I bowl, I turn the ball (I get on the side of the ball a lot) and it causes me to clip the middle finger hole and the thumb hole. Sometime even clipping the ring finger hole!!! I am very accurate and percise on speed.

Ive tried taking tips from other bowlers and nothing helps!!

I am trying to become the best bowler I can be but it sucks cause as I roll the ball down the lane i hear.. clump..clump clump..

PLEASE SOME TIPS!?!?!?!?!

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 Post subject: Re: Clipping Middle Finger Hole and Thumb Hole
 Posted: Wed Aug 18, 2010 9:14 am Post Number: #2 Post
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When I roll the ball, i feel as if my thumb comes out perfect and my fingers are doing the hooking. But once the ball comes back and i see my tracks over the holes.. its just like damn.. it felt good..

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 Post subject: Re: Clipping Middle Finger Hole and Thumb Hole
 Posted: Wed Aug 18, 2010 12:54 pm Post Number: #3 Post
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You are probably throwing the ball with a full roller release. Your fingers are moving clockwise at the moment of release. This movement is probably created from your many years of throwing a back up release. Try to rotate the fingers in a counter clockwise movement. ie from a 6:00 to 4:00 movement.


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 Post subject: Re: Clipping Middle Finger Hole and Thumb Hole
 Posted: Wed Aug 18, 2010 4:34 pm Post Number: #4 Post
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Great response proshop.
I agree 100%.

When converting from back up ball to a hook type release
bowlers tend to get the hand in a suit case position at the top of the swing.
Then during the forward swing they rotate the hand clockwise (right handed bowler) creating a full roller type of release.

You also suggested rotating the hand counter clockwise (6 to 4 o'clock - right handed bowler).
Another excellent tip!

Typically, I find changing releasessometimes requires bizarre thinking.

I would suggest during practice to slow down the pace of the armswing during the release (think 12 miles per hour ball speed) and over rotating the hand counter clockwise (6 to 12 o'clock for a right handed bowler).

Granted, I don't want to turn this bowler into a spinner, but making small incremental
positional changes in hand position is very difficult for the high level athelte let alone someone converting from back up to hook ball release.

The reason for slowing the armswing pace is to give the hand time to rotate during the
release. Fast arm swings require very fast hand action. Once this bowler starts to feel and see some rotation and hook, then it is time to pick up the swing tempo.

If indeed this bowler does manage to get to 12 o'clock position at release (congratulations), than it is time to work on reducing the amount of rotation.
Subject for another day.

Releases are one of the hardest parts of the game to master. Patience and a good coach can help in this area.

Just one man's opinion
Jim

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 Post subject: Re: Clipping Middle Finger Hole and Thumb Hole
 Posted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 6:05 am Post Number: #5 Post
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JAlvarez86-
Let me follow up Coach Merrell comments. Your thumb position at the moment of release will always reveal your initial track position. If you are clipping the holes than your thumb is stright up at the moment of release AND, most probably, your thumb is also rotating clockwise very slightly at the moment of release. This movement is due to the physiology of your arms (Test: put your arms down to your sides with the palm open toward the person in front of you- do your arms bow away from your body? If so then this is probably the cause of the clockwise movement of your thumb. You are doing what your body wants to do naturally). If you are a "stroker" or "tweener", try dropping your thumb down to your palm as the ball passes your knee on the downswing. This is a tradional Dick Ritger move and it may work for you as it will prabably force the finger to rotate counter clockwise while leaving the thumb in a non clockwise position. Remember the thumb down movement is a gentle movement with no squeeze or force- hold a ball like you would hold a bird, don't kill it (source: Don Johnson). Let me know how this works for you,
-Gary Parsons

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 Post subject: Re: Clipping Middle Finger Hole and Thumb Hole
 Posted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 3:02 pm Post Number: #6 Post
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JAlvarez86 wrote:
Alright, So I have been bowling for around 7 years now. For the first 5 years I was throwing a back up ball. I taught myself how to throw a regular hook now. Im right handed.

I averaged 194 last year in league and hoping over 200 this year.

One major problem I have that I can not fix is that, when I bowl, I turn the ball (I get on the side of the ball a lot) and it causes me to clip the middle finger hole and the thumb hole. Sometime even clipping the ring finger hole!!! I am very accurate and percise on speed.

Ive tried taking tips from other bowlers and nothing helps!!

I am trying to become the best bowler I can be but it sucks cause as I roll the ball down the lane i hear.. clump..clump clump..

PLEASE SOME TIPS!?!?!?!?!


Your issue is related to the release. It may require a good coach, but also can be helped by checking your fit. I'm not going to speculate, so where are you located? I may be able to suggest someone nearby that can help your problem immensely.


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 Post subject: Re: Clipping Middle Finger Hole and Thumb Hole
 Posted: Sat Aug 21, 2010 1:15 am Post Number: #7 Post
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Alright guys.. all your tips are great.. but when i say the thumb hole is clipping.. i mean my track lines are over my finger holes and over my thumb hole.. it varies..

On fresh oil my track line is barely clipping the middle finger hole and over my thumb (from the 15board and straight up the 10 board and hitting pocket nice.. but when the lanes are dry and im throwing out alot more ( like throwing from 23 board out to 6 or 7) my track lines are over my ring finger and past my thumb hole.

It is caused from not staying behind the ball.. on my back swing i am behind the ball nice but as my arm swing comes back down i am on the side of the ball causing me to throw over the ball.. its like i am forcing the ball to hook with my whole hand when i should be hooking the ball with the fingers.. its hard to describe..

I have a few videos and if i can post them on here i will but if not then i will send some ppl the video to view me bowling..

Also i live in central illinois.. about half an hr away from champaign..

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 Post subject: Re: Clipping Middle Finger Hole and Thumb Hole
 Posted: Sat Aug 21, 2010 1:22 am Post Number: #8 Post
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I had similar problems earlier this year and Mo fixed me up real good. I'm sure he can help you with a solution as well. :) Give it a chance.

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 Post subject: Re: Clipping Middle Finger Hole and Thumb Hole
 Posted: Sat Aug 21, 2010 1:35 am Post Number: #9 Post
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JAlvarez86 wrote:
Alright guys.. all your tips are great.. but when i say the thumb hole is clipping.. i mean my track lines are over my finger holes and over my thumb hole.. it varies..

On fresh oil my track line is barely clipping the middle finger hole and over my thumb (from the 15board and straight up the 10 board and hitting pocket nice.. but when the lanes are dry and im throwing out alot more ( like throwing from 23 board out to 6 or 7) my track lines are over my ring finger and past my thumb hole.

It is caused from not staying behind the ball.. on my back swing i am behind the ball nice but as my arm swing comes back down i am on the side of the ball causing me to throw over the ball.. its like i am forcing the ball to hook with my whole hand when i should be hooking the ball with the fingers.. its hard to describe..

I have a few videos and if i can post them on here i will but if not then i will send some ppl the video to view me bowling..

Also i live in central illinois.. about half an hr away from champaign..


I was in Decatur, IL last Sat. and Sun. Sorry we missed each other. See Jason Queen. He lives near there and can probably help you. Please post your videos so I can see.


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 Post subject: Re: Clipping Middle Finger Hole and Thumb Hole
 Posted: Sat Aug 21, 2010 1:38 am Post Number: #10 Post
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kellytehuna wrote:
I had similar problems earlier this year and Mo fixed me up real good. I'm sure he can help you with a solution as well. :) Give it a chance.


Check out the before and after videos that kellytehuna posted.

Kiwi, please post the link to those videos here.


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 Post subject: Re: Clipping Middle Finger Hole and Thumb Hole
 Posted: Sat Aug 21, 2010 5:06 am Post Number: #11 Post
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Pre Mo Session


Post Mo Session


You should see a definite improvement in timing, tempo and solidity at the line. All very important to consistent shot making.

I must admit that I've regressed a little, due to a severe lack of practice time over the last 2 months, but I'm getting back in to a decent practice schedule, so hopefully I'll start finding some consistency again.

I can truthfully say that I saw more improvement in just two sessions with Mo (one in March, one in June) than I've seen in any other period prior. I'm hoping to get another session in the nearish future. :)

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 Post subject: Re: Clipping Middle Finger Hole and Thumb Hole
 Posted: Sat Aug 21, 2010 5:10 pm Post Number: #12 Post
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ok guys thanks...yea u look similar to me when i bowl..

i am going try and go bowling today and get some good videos of me bowling,,check back tonight or tomorrow guys..thanks

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 Post subject: Re: Clipping Middle Finger Hole and Thumb Hole
 Posted: Sun Aug 22, 2010 3:53 pm Post Number: #13 Post
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It looks as if i was bowling the same in every clip but i wasnt.. it was a different throw every time..

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 Post subject: Re: Clipping Middle Finger Hole and Thumb Hole
 Posted: Sun Aug 22, 2010 9:10 pm Post Number: #14 Post
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JAlvarez86 wrote:


It looks as if i was bowling the same in every clip but i wasnt.. it was a different throw every time..


Your fingers NEVER get to the left side of the ball at the top of the back swing. As the ball goes by your leg going to the top of the backswing roll your right and up to get your fingers on the inside of the ball. Look up Jason Queen and tell him my suggestions. I'm sure he can help you.

What's probably very important is to read the "Changing initial Track" thread on the Certified Coaching Forum and learn to cock, not cup your wrist.


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 Post subject: Re: Clipping Middle Finger Hole and Thumb Hole
 Posted: Mon Aug 23, 2010 3:32 am Post Number: #15 Post
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ok thanks for the guys name.. i will definitly have to get ahold of him..

thanks guys

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 Post subject: Re: Clipping Middle Finger Hole and Thumb Hole
 Posted: Mon Aug 23, 2010 1:12 pm Post Number: #16 Post
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other than my track lines being over my holes.. does any 1 have any advice for me the way i bowl..i am a very consistent bowler. my speed sometimes varies but its usully not off much and i am usually right on my mark..

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 Post subject: Re: Clipping Middle Finger Hole and Thumb Hole
 Posted: Mon Aug 23, 2010 1:19 pm Post Number: #17 Post
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JAlvarez86 wrote:
other than my track lines being over my holes.. does any 1 have any advice for me the way i bowl..i am a very consistent bowler. my speed sometimes varies but its usully not off much and i am usually right on my mark..


Your game looks good. A little softer knee at the finish and hold your finish a little longer. Basically, a good game once you lower your track.


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 Post subject: Re: Clipping Middle Finger Hole and Thumb Hole
 Posted: Wed Aug 25, 2010 5:18 pm Post Number: #18 Post
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ok.. im going to go get some practice in today..things i really want to work on are staying behind the ball on my back swing.

On my backswing my wrist is already turned. Causing me to go over the ball on my release.. Ive been workin on that without a bowling ball so hopefully i can figure it out quick.

And also work on my stance at the line. Watching the video i am not very stable at the line and could be a lot better..

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 Post subject: Re: Clipping Middle Finger Hole and Thumb Hole
 Posted: Wed Aug 25, 2010 6:54 pm Post Number: #19 Post
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JAlvarez86 wrote:
ok.. im going to go get some practice in today..things i really want to work on are staying behind the ball on my back swing.

On my backswing my wrist is already turned. Causing me to go over the ball on my release.. Ive been workin on that without a bowling ball so hopefully i can figure it out quick.

And also work on my stance at the line. Watching the video i am not very stable at the line and could be a lot better..


How about addressing my suggestions in post #14? I get the feeling you're not focusing on the suggestions already made.


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 Post subject: Re: Clipping Middle Finger Hole and Thumb Hole
 Posted: Thu Aug 26, 2010 4:00 am Post Number: #20 Post
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Mo Pinel wrote:
JAlvarez86 wrote:
ok.. im going to go get some practice in today..things i really want to work on are staying behind the ball on my back swing.

On my backswing my wrist is already turned. Causing me to go over the ball on my release.. Ive been workin on that without a bowling ball so hopefully i can figure it out quick.

And also work on my stance at the line. Watching the video i am not very stable at the line and could be a lot better..


How about addressing my suggestions in post #14? I get the feeling you're not focusing on the suggestions already made.


I understand what you were talking about but if you were me its harder said then done.. I tried everything tonight and everytime i think i am throwing the ball good.. my tracks are worse (over my ring finger and atleast an inch past the thumb hole) ..

I came to the conclusion that i am going to need a good coach..i was trying for 4 games to keep my fingers left as i rolled the ball but i always ended up on the right side and rolling the ball with my whole hand and wrist..idk...its very fustrating..thanks for the tips guys..

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