Board index » Coaching Forums » Coaching Discussion




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 15 posts ] 
Author Message
 Post subject: Playing the inside line
 Posted: Fri Jul 22, 2011 3:08 am Post Number: #1 Post
Offline
Pro Shop
User avatar

Joined: July 3, 2009
Posts: 276
Location: Binghamton, NY
Reputation: 12
Reputation Power: 1
Any hints, tips or drills for teaching yourself to play a tight inside line?

It's becoming increasingly difficult to play right of 15 at our center due to the sponges being thrown by the elder statesmen in in our leagues.

I would like to be able to move in and play 20 to no further right than 12. I am very erratic at this point...any training drills anybody can suggest other than just practice, practice, practice??

Thanks in advance.....

_________________
Doug Sterner
Doug's Pro Shop
Owego, NY



Proudly providing the southern tier of NY with the
best pro shop experience in the area.


Top 
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Playing the inside line
 Posted: Fri Jul 22, 2011 11:54 pm Post Number: #2 Post
Offline
Member

Joined: September 29, 2010
Posts: 330
Reputation: 0
Reputation Power: 1
Draw a line from your break point back to the arrows. Next align your shoulder with that line by opening your stance and positioning your elbow rearward slightly. Now push-away along that line looking through your target at the arrows and then down to your break point through the release. This works very well for myself but if you have figure eight swing then it will be bit diff.


Top 
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Playing the inside line
 Posted: Sat Jul 23, 2011 12:19 am Post Number: #3 Post
Offline
Certified Coach
User avatar

Joined: October 25, 2010
Posts: 1612
Location: Sun City Arizona
Reputation: 339
Reputation Power: 4
Here's some links for your perusal
http://www.bowl4fun.com/ron/tip42_files/tip42.htm
At some point contemplate adding this to the drill
http://www.bowl4fun.com/ron/tip3.htm

http://www.bowl4fun.com/ron/btm01_files/btm1.htm

I left off Ron's 3 parter "Break Points and drawing lines on the lane"

If you are not familiar with Ron's articles, give it a gander. He's a good communicator!

I had the good fortune to meet, chat with and observe Ron work with a few bowlers here in the Phoenix Arizona area. I already knew he was a very good instructor. I came away from the experience very impressed by what a quality human being he his.

Joe Slowinski adds a focal point to the targeting system
http://bowlingknowledge.info/images/sto ... geting.pdf

If you can obtain permission from the center.Ron Clifton's Magic Carpet tape makes a nice visual and audible (providing the center is not getting the Led out) targeting device.
Realistically hitting 1 board at the breakpoints time after time is upper echelon PBA caliber, so putting two parallel pieces of tape several boards apart like a doorway for your ball to walk thru might be better. You can use 1 piece for the near target and if you are WRW Jr 1 at the far point :P

Aside from tape which is cheap and abundant, one could always build a targeting set -
basic premise, an object is suspended/dangled above the lane for the ball to hit.
Several of these could be used at various distances.

Bowl or practice with a buddy, make a contest for a coke or whatever . Also to watch and critique each other, (what you think you hit versus what he thinks you hit)

Also, I'd advocate posing at the line in your finishing position to watch the ball until it fall into the pit. Path, transition, path thru pins, nature of pin action, location entering the pit; where did your foot end up, board, direction.
This is a good habit, it also exercises your legs more and helps you realize how balanced you are. Closing the eyes, is a tad advanced but helps you feel things and trust things.
I'd advise the closed eye drill without a ball first to evaluate whether or not you should try it with a ball. You close your eyes at the apex of the swing ...

Good Luck and Good Bowling.

What do you think?

_________________
"There are many worlds out there. Some of them can be accessed through reading.
Encourage kids to read" - T.A. Sankar


John


Last edited by kajmk on Sat Jul 23, 2011 10:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Top 
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Playing the inside line
 Posted: Sat Jul 23, 2011 2:46 am Post Number: #4 Post
Offline
Trusted Source

Joined: January 30, 2010
Posts: 2535
Location: Hawesville KY/Tell City IN
Reputation: 183
Reputation Power: 2
Quote:
If you can obtain permission from the center.Ron Clifton's Magic Carpet tape makes a nice visual and audible (providing the center is not getting the Led out) targeting device.
Realistically hitting 1 board at the breakpoints time after time is upper echelon PBA caliber, so putting two parallel pieces of tape several boards apart like a doorway for your ball to walk thru might be better. You can use 1 piece for the near target and if you are WRW Jr 1 at the far point


I use white adhesive tape, two or three pieces layered and cut to the length I want the pupil to hit. I usually use three inches for up to about 180 average bowlers and two inches for higher averages. You can hear the ball "clunk" when it hits the tape. Don't put it on the lanes yourself, have an employee do it. That way you know it's approved. -- JohnP


Top 
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Playing the inside line
 Posted: Sat Jul 23, 2011 1:19 pm Post Number: #5 Post
Offline
Mo Pinel
User avatar

Joined: January 26, 2010
Posts: 9522
Reputation: 552
Reputation Power: 6
dougsterner wrote:
Any hints, tips or drills for teaching yourself to play a tight inside line?

It's becoming increasingly difficult to play right of 15 at our center due to the sponges being thrown by the elder statesmen in in our leagues.

I would like to be able to move in and play 20 to no further right than 12. I am very erratic at this point...any training drills anybody can suggest other than just practice, practice, practice??

Thanks in advance.....


Doug,

Use focal points. They're in the "See It, Feel It, Do It" manual and the "Playing the High Friction Game" CD. I believe you have both.

Mo


Top 
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Playing the inside line
 Posted: Sun Jul 24, 2011 3:08 am Post Number: #6 Post
Offline
Pro Shop
User avatar

Joined: July 3, 2009
Posts: 276
Location: Binghamton, NY
Reputation: 12
Reputation Power: 1
Thanks to all....I have come to the conclusion that I need to keep the ball inside of the 10 board at the breakpoint to maintain a shot that will hold for 3 games. If I can train myself to do this, I am going to have a much better season....

_________________
Doug Sterner
Doug's Pro Shop
Owego, NY



Proudly providing the southern tier of NY with the
best pro shop experience in the area.


Top 
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Playing the inside line
 Posted: Mon Jul 25, 2011 1:41 am Post Number: #7 Post
Offline
Member

Joined: September 29, 2010
Posts: 330
Reputation: 0
Reputation Power: 1
dougsterner wrote:
Thanks to all....I have come to the conclusion that I need to keep the ball inside of the 10 board at the breakpoint to maintain a shot that will hold for 3 games. If I can train myself to do this, I am going to have a much better season....

you need to remain versatle, don't limit yourself to one area. staying inside 10 at the break point may not yeild a good reaction if the backends are not crisp. Sometimes you have to get the ball outside to get enough dry so the ball can start to grip the lane. As the night goes on you usually will be able to pull your break point inside.


Top 
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Playing the inside line
 Posted: Mon Jul 25, 2011 3:32 am Post Number: #8 Post
Offline
Pro Shop
User avatar

Joined: July 3, 2009
Posts: 276
Location: Binghamton, NY
Reputation: 12
Reputation Power: 1
while I thank you for the added wisdom crazyjim, I need to say that I have come to this conclusion based on 3 years worth of bowling here. bumping the ball outside of the 10 board results in an extreme over-reaction that is difficult to control and predict.

keeping the ball tighter keeps the ball playable and predictable for 3 games...hence the reason I want to teach myself to play in there.

_________________
Doug Sterner
Doug's Pro Shop
Owego, NY



Proudly providing the southern tier of NY with the
best pro shop experience in the area.


Top 
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Playing the inside line
 Posted: Mon Jul 25, 2011 3:33 am Post Number: #9 Post
Online
Moderator
User avatar

Joined: April 26, 2007
Posts: 2964
Location: Malta, NY
Reputation: 550
Reputation Power: 6
If you're getting an extreme over reaction, try dropping down a grit.

_________________
"Its all about the roll."
Press the Image button if you feel I've been helpful.
Help us pay our hosting fees, donate today!
Click Here to Donate.


Top 
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Playing the inside line
 Posted: Fri Jul 29, 2011 1:15 am Post Number: #10 Post
Offline
Certified Coach
User avatar

Joined: April 15, 2011
Posts: 65
Location: Seffner, Florida
Reputation: 6
Reputation Power: 1
Doug what type of balls are you using, what's your average speed, and do you crank the ball or are you a tweener ? Just wondering how aggressive they are and if you are using too much ball for the oil ? I agree with the previous reply about also buffing it up a little.

Bob

_________________
Bob
USBC Certified Bronze Level Coach
300 games - 8 (sanctioned)
800 series - 4 (high 856)
Hall of Fame - 1996 - SE CT Bowling Assoc


Top 
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Playing the inside line
 Posted: Fri Aug 12, 2011 3:48 am Post Number: #11 Post
Offline
Pro Shop
User avatar

Joined: July 3, 2009
Posts: 276
Location: Binghamton, NY
Reputation: 12
Reputation Power: 1
Sorry for not getting back on this thread sooner but....

tampabaybob......my favorite ball last season was a Hammer Infection drilled 60x5-1/2x65 with a P3 hole. The next ball out of my bag was the Hammer Blue/Silver Backlash drilled 60x4x60with P2 hole. I have access to plenty of stuff but that's what I was most successful with.

Average speed...around 17 off my hand, rev rate in the 300-325 range, low tilt and low rotation (mo, justin and mike can chime in if they think I am out of line with my specs, since they have seen me bowl at the clinic).

I have used all of the following with success at some point however.....Swagga, Sting, Jacked, red/Purple Backlash, Midnight Vibe, Jigsaw Trap, Tsunami and a Tropical Heat Hybrid.

As you can see I have tried a variety of balls and have been successful with many different brands, covers and layouts. I am just searching for something consistent that gives me some margin for error.

_________________
Doug Sterner
Doug's Pro Shop
Owego, NY



Proudly providing the southern tier of NY with the
best pro shop experience in the area.


Last edited by dougsterner on Sun Aug 14, 2011 1:33 am, edited 1 time in total.

Top 
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Playing the inside line
 Posted: Sat Aug 13, 2011 9:34 pm Post Number: #12 Post
Offline
Senior Member
User avatar

Joined: September 1, 2010
Posts: 1387
Location: Canada
Reputation: 134
Reputation Power: 2
dougsterner wrote:
Sorry for not getting back on this thread sooner but....

tampabaybob......my favorite ball last season was a Hammer Infection drilled 60x5-1/2x65 with a P3 hole. The next ball out of my bag was the Hammer Blue/Silver Backlash drilled 60x4x60with P2 hole. I have access to plenty of stuff but that's what I was most successful with.

Average speed...around 17 off my hand, rev rate in the 300-325 range, low tilt and low rotation.

I have used all of the following with success at some point however.....Swagga, Sting, Jacked, red/Purple Backlash, Midnight Vibe, Jigsaw Trap, Tsunami and a Tropical Heat Hybrid.

As you can see I have tried a variety of balls and have been successful with many different brands, covers and layouts. I am just searching for something consistent that gives me some margin for error.


Doug... I notice your delivery specs and your layouts. I'd like to point out with your speed, ball layouts, and low rotation, your not likely going to be able to get matched up. See also what others think as well.

You need a lower Val angle .... like 30* +/-, higher ratios, say 2.5:1 and higher rotation angles in the area of 70 to 80 to enable you to make the ball come back to the pocket. Your speed, low rotation and VAL angles of 60-65 are making the ball go too long.

I suspect your finding a lot of situations when your in deep where the ball goes wide and never gets back to the pocket or your not so wide and find the ball grabs too early, never getting right of the pocket. I'm assuming right handed here also.

_________________
High Game - 300 (20), 299 (10), 298 (1), 11 in a row (15)
High Series - (278 Triplicate) = 834 (8)
HOF induction - 2 (1 Local and 1 Provincial)
Is this helpful? Then Click the Image on the bottom right.


Top 
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Playing the inside line
 Posted: Sun Aug 14, 2011 1:57 am Post Number: #13 Post
Offline
Pro Shop
User avatar

Joined: July 3, 2009
Posts: 276
Location: Binghamton, NY
Reputation: 12
Reputation Power: 1
triplicate....again I appreciate the response but you are missing the point. I have plenty of equipment that will work well for me. The problem I am experiencing is that the oil pattern we are using becomes a nightmare. The length, shape and volume of the pattern used caters to the knuckleballers who are still using Danger Zones and Blue Hammers. The full rollers are using Virtual Gravitys etc up the 10 board and are just torching the outside part of the lane. I am not consistently able to control the ball reaction out there since I am forced to go away from my A game and options B and C are still in need of work. So I have decided to move to a part of the lane that gets very little play and will hold up with minor adjustments throughouot the night.

I was soliciting practice drills or coaching techniques to help increase my consistency when playing in that area of the lane....ball choice is not an issue....Mo has assisted me with arsenal set up so I have a good selection at my disposal. The higher VAL angles were chosen to help smooth out the ball's reaction to the huge friction we see on the backend of the lane.

_________________
Doug Sterner
Doug's Pro Shop
Owego, NY



Proudly providing the southern tier of NY with the
best pro shop experience in the area.


Top 
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Playing the inside line
 Posted: Sun Aug 14, 2011 1:05 pm Post Number: #14 Post
Offline
Member

Joined: May 10, 2011
Posts: 53
Reputation: 6
Reputation Power: 1
I don't know if this applies to you or not, but often when bowlers have trouble moving in because they can't get the ball back, it has to do with the hand position at release. Traditional bowlers were taught to release the ball with their hand on the side in order to get traditional bowling balls to hook. Contemporary bowlers, ones who move left with ease, keep their hand on the inside lower quadrant of the ball until the thumb has exited, allowing them to project the ball to the right as they release through it. When the hand is on the outside of the ball as the thumb exits, the natural tendency is to come around it more the deeper they play. This causes the ball to lose power resulting in an inability to turn the corner and carry.

I wrote an article called "Release Timing" in the May 2011 BTM. It addresses this in length and has some good illustrations. You might want to try and get your hands on a copy and see if this may apply to you.

Rob Mautner


Top 
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Playing the inside line
 Posted: Sun Aug 14, 2011 8:17 pm Post Number: #15 Post
Offline
Pro Shop
User avatar

Joined: July 3, 2009
Posts: 276
Location: Binghamton, NY
Reputation: 12
Reputation Power: 1
Thanks Rob...I have that issue....I'll go reread it :-)

My problems with my home house have been documented over and over. We have a decently blended pattern left to right but front to back there is very little taper. So what happens is that you see lots of friction in the last 20 feet. When you combine this with a worn ball track and the oil pattern, it gets touchy as the lanes break down. The heads start to go away right of the 3rd arrow and the mids burn right of 12 and we don't get any carrydown. So basically what I see is hooking heads, hooking mids and hooking backends.

Using a weaker ball out there still requires me to alter my release outside of my comfort zone which makes me erratic. This is the path I though was preferred over the last few years and I have thrown lots of layouts and surfaces at the problem but have not been able to match up.

So I decided to try a move away from the rest of the players and move to a tight inside line. I am having some issues training myself to play in here, hence my request for suggestions on playing the inside line. I am not trying to play 20 to 5 or anything. I want to stay 20 to say 15 or 14 or so.

Thanks again for the advice.

_________________
Doug Sterner
Doug's Pro Shop
Owego, NY



Proudly providing the southern tier of NY with the
best pro shop experience in the area.


Top 
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
 
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 15 posts ] 

Board index » Coaching Forums » Coaching Discussion


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: runitout123 and 2 guests

 
 

 
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to: