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 Post subject: Ball Recommendation Mo??
 Posted: Thu Oct 28, 2010 1:51 am Post Number: #1 Post
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Hi Mo- I just read your article on diff ratio. I am hoping you can recommend one of your balls for me. I am formerly know as Adrienne Fello, from Syracuse, NY. I met you through Mike Luongo a few years back. You came and worked with me in Syracuse and I had a lot of success. I am still pretty speed dominant and my axis tilt might have snuck up a little bit since we changed my layout when you were here. I have tilted my fingers on an angle slightly in an attempt to make my layout feel like that of an offset thumb. I am averaging around 215, a little lower than I would like (I know...I am never satisfied), and am still most comfortable around 8-10. I am looking for a ball for the fresh that I can swing out to the dry (maybe 11 to 7). Any ideas?? I really want to win our local queens this year and do well in the women's nat'ls, which happen to be here. Are you ever going to be back in the area??


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 Post subject: Re: Ball Recommendation Mo??
 Posted: Thu Oct 28, 2010 5:37 pm Post Number: #2 Post
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AdrienneTurbeville wrote:
Hi Mo- I just read your article on diff ratio. I am hoping you can recommend one of your balls for me. I am formerly know as Adrienne Fello, from Syracuse, NY. I met you through Mike Luongo a few years back. You came and worked with me in Syracuse and I had a lot of success. I am still pretty speed dominant and my axis tilt might have snuck up a little bit since we changed my layout when you were here. I have tilted my fingers on an angle slightly in an attempt to make my layout feel like that of an offset thumb. I am averaging around 215, a little lower than I would like (I know...I am never satisfied), and am still most comfortable around 8-10. I am looking for a ball for the fresh that I can swing out to the dry (maybe 11 to 7). Any ideas?? I really want to win our local queens this year and do well in the women's nat'ls, which happen to be here. Are you ever going to be back in the area??


Adrienne, good to hear from you. The pink is a nice touch. Who's doing your drilling, since it's no longer in the family? I just talked to Mike McCracken at Flamingo. We're trying to put something together for December. Keep in touch with them. I recommend using the appropriate midlane layout for your PAP from "Mo's Recommended Layouts for Asymmetrical Balls" in the Wiki. The current balls I recommend for you for this are the MoRich mania, the Brunswick Wicked Siege, and the Storm Anarchy.


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 Post subject: Re: Ball Recommendation Mo??
 Posted: Thu Oct 28, 2010 5:51 pm Post Number: #3 Post
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As a courtesy:

http://wiki.bowlingchat.net/wiki/index. ... dedLayouts

Welcome to the website.

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 Post subject: Re: Ball Recommendation Mo??
 Posted: Thu Dec 23, 2010 5:41 pm Post Number: #4 Post
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Hi Mo,
Thanks for the recommendations. I haven't purchased a ball yet, but I did win the queens. :) Brian O'Mara at beginners to pros in Rochester is doing my drilling. He works for Brad Buckert. They are great...very knowledgeable and precise. Happy Holidays! I'll be in touch...my husband would love to pick your brain sometime about layouts for himself (rev-dominant with slower ball speed). He loves trying unique/unorthodox drillings.


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 Post subject: Re: Ball Recommendation Mo??
 Posted: Thu Dec 23, 2010 6:01 pm Post Number: #5 Post
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AdrienneTurbeville wrote:
Hi Mo,
Thanks for the recommendations. I haven't purchased a ball yet, but I did win the queens. :) Brian O'Mara at beginners to pros in Rochester is doing my drilling. He works for Brad Buckert. They are great...very knowledgeable and precise. Happy Holidays! I'll be in touch...my husband would love to pick your brain sometime about layouts for himself (rev-dominant with slower ball speed). He loves trying unique/unorthodox drillings.


Sounds like the perfect guy for you..................unique/unorthodox........................
Merry Christmas! I've known Brian for years. He knows what he's doing.


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 Post subject: Re: Ball Recommendation Mo??
 Posted: Fri Dec 31, 2010 4:24 am Post Number: #6 Post
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Hi Mo,

I hope your holidays were merry! I'm going to turn the computer over to my husband so he can ask you a few questions about layouts. Yes...I'm making him type in pink. :)

Hi Mo: Thank you for taking the time to offer me some of your thoughts. Ultimately, I would be very interested and thankful for insight regarding a few possible layouts. I know that this is not a simple request and what to thank you in advance for any thoughts you might have.
I came back to bowling about 6 years ago after some time away from the game. I experienced some quick success throwing old, very weak equipment (like the Columbia Orange Piranha). As these balls have faded, I have been looking for modern alternatives. I have really enjoyed learning more about ball layouts and ball motion over the last few years and have been using your dual angle strategy for the last three years. Currently, I carry four balls to league, which are on a traditional house pattern: 1) Lane #1 Chainsaw (75 x 6 1/8 x 45) This is the ball I throw the most and is the same layout that was on a number of the older balls I had success with. 2) Columbia White Dot (4000 aberlon) I use this frequently too, when pattern breaks down and they get dry. I know this is a little crazy, but it has been working well. 3) Lane #1 XXXL (plastic – polished) I use this when they get really dry. 4) Storm Hyroad (135 x 5 ¾ x 50) someone just gave this ball to me about a month ago, and I chose to try this layout and have been able to use it if there is more oil. I don’t use it much.
As you can see, on the THP I don’t have a great deal of options in my current arsenal. I used to bowl in a PBA league, but don’t any longer. I do bowl in a few tournaments here and there that are on sport patterns, including our yearly trip to the USBC nationals. However, as of late the majority of my bowling is done on variety of house patterns.
A few details for you, my PAP is 5 ½ up 1, I am right handed and track very high. I have tried a pin axis layout before and liked it. However, I found that I needed the perfect condition to be successful with it. When they are too dry it hooks very early, and when there is a bit too much oil, all I would leave are 10 pins.
I was recently introduced to what I believe is called a “tunnel” drilling, by a local ball driller, Mike McCracken. This layout put the pin in my track on the center of my grip and in line with the mass bias. I tried this on an old ball (with a lot of plugs) as a test and liked it. I am considering trying it on a new one. What do you think?
If there is anything else I can share that will help with your suggestions, please let me know. Thank you very much for your time. I enjoy your articles in BTM magazine and look forward to the next one.
Happy New Year! John


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 Post subject: Re: Ball Recommendation Mo??
 Posted: Fri Dec 31, 2010 10:56 pm Post Number: #7 Post
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AdrienneTurbeville wrote:
Hi Mo,

I hope your holidays were merry! I'm going to turn the computer over to my husband so he can ask you a few questions about layouts. Yes...I'm making him type in pink. :)

Hi Mo: Thank you for taking the time to offer me some of your thoughts. Ultimately, I would be very interested and thankful for insight regarding a few possible layouts. I know that this is not a simple request and what to thank you in advance for any thoughts you might have.
I came back to bowling about 6 years ago after some time away from the game. I experienced some quick success throwing old, very weak equipment (like the Columbia Orange Piranha). As these balls have faded, I have been looking for modern alternatives. I have really enjoyed learning more about ball layouts and ball motion over the last few years and have been using your dual angle strategy for the last three years. Currently, I carry four balls to league, which are on a traditional house pattern: 1) Lane #1 Chainsaw (75 x 6 1/8 x 45) This is the ball I throw the most and is the same layout that was on a number of the older balls I had success with. 2) Columbia White Dot (4000 aberlon) I use this frequently too, when pattern breaks down and they get dry. I know this is a little crazy, but it has been working well. 3) Lane #1 XXXL (plastic – polished) I use this when they get really dry. 4) Storm Hyroad (135 x 5 ¾ x 50) someone just gave this ball to me about a month ago, and I chose to try this layout and have been able to use it if there is more oil. I don’t use it much.
As you can see, on the THP I don’t have a great deal of options in my current arsenal. I used to bowl in a PBA league, but don’t any longer. I do bowl in a few tournaments here and there that are on sport patterns, including our yearly trip to the USBC nationals. However, as of late the majority of my bowling is done on variety of house patterns.
A few details for you, my PAP is 5 ½ up 1, I am right handed and track very high. I have tried a pin axis layout before and liked it. However, I found that I needed the perfect condition to be successful with it. When they are too dry it hooks very early, and when there is a bit too much oil, all I would leave are 10 pins.
I was recently introduced to what I believe is called a “tunnel” drilling, by a local ball driller, Mike McCracken. This layout put the pin in my track on the center of my grip and in line with the mass bias. I tried this on an old ball (with a lot of plugs) as a test and liked it. I am considering trying it on a new one. What do you think?
If there is anything else I can share that will help with your suggestions, please let me know. Thank you very much for your time. I enjoy your articles in BTM magazine and look forward to the next one.
Happy New Year! John


Looking at what you wrote, I see the Sposato influence. Not a surprise, being it's Syracuse. I see that you like very little flare because of your high track. I'd like to performance fit you to increase your rotation and tilt. That will open up the spectrum of layouts and reactions for you. Please post your grip specs, with FULL spans and all the pitches. I'll recommend a performance fit for you. Let attack the source of the problem.


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 Post subject: Re: Ball Recommendation Mo??
 Posted: Sat Jan 01, 2011 2:43 am Post Number: #8 Post
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Quote:
This layout put the pin in my track on the center of my grip and in line with the mass bias.


If the pin is both in your track and on grip center you would be a full roller, but full rollers have a 6 3/4" horizontal PAP component. I'm more confused than normal! -- JohnP


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 Post subject: Re: Ball Recommendation Mo??
 Posted: Sat Jan 01, 2011 8:58 pm Post Number: #9 Post
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Hi Mo-

Thank you for the quick response and I am very interested in possible adjustments to my grip.

I would definitely say that the access to Richies stuff has resulted in me throwing more of it, but I am looking for what works.

Interestingly enough, when I was having my success a couple years back, I used a drop ring finger to help cut down on my rev rate. I was beginning to experience some pain in my hand and change to a more conventional grip and while there is no pain, things have never been the same on the lanes. Here are the specs for the more traditional grip I have been using in the last couple of years.

Net span (finger tip grip with inserts): Middle finger 4 ¼ : Ring finger 4 3/8
Middle finger: 1/16 forward and ¼ left
Ringer finger: 1/16 reverse and 3/8 right
Oval Thumb: 1/8 reverse and 0 with a 2 ½ cut 45 degree oval

In the last month, I have been trying some different pitches including more forward pitch in the fingers and have also tried a different oval of 35 degrees. I never changed the oval when I went away from the drop ring finger, should I have done this?

Thanks again and I look forward to hearing back from you.
John


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 Post subject: Re: Ball Recommendation Mo??
 Posted: Tue Jan 04, 2011 1:34 pm Post Number: #10 Post
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AdrienneTurbeville wrote:
Hi Mo-

Thank you for the quick response and I am very interested in possible adjustments to my grip.

I would definitely say that the access to Richies stuff has resulted in me throwing more of it, but I am looking for what works.

Interestingly enough, when I was having my success a couple years back, I used a drop ring finger to help cut down on my rev rate. I was beginning to experience some pain in my hand and change to a more conventional grip and while there is no pain, things have never been the same on the lanes. Here are the specs for the more traditional grip I have been using in the last couple of years.

Net span (finger tip grip with inserts): Middle finger 4 ¼ : Ring finger 4 3/8
Middle finger: 1/16 forward and ¼ left
Ringer finger: 1/16 reverse and 3/8 right
Oval Thumb: 1/8 reverse and 0 with a 2 ½ cut 45 degree oval

In the last month, I have been trying some different pitches including more forward pitch in the fingers and have also tried a different oval of 35 degrees. I never changed the oval when I went away from the drop ring finger, should I have done this?

Thanks again and I look forward to hearing back from you.
John


A couple of questions before I make the adjustments. What are your full spans? Do you use inserts? What type of inserts? Do you tend to stay in the ball too long or get out of it a little soon? Answer those questions. please and I'll take a swing at it.


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 Post subject: Re: Ball Recommendation Mo??
 Posted: Wed Jan 05, 2011 12:42 am Post Number: #11 Post
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Sorry, but I am not sure what you mean by my full spans. The measurements I provided are the cuts. If you let me know how to measure that you need, I can do that.

Yes, I use inserts. Turbo 2-n-1 quads, I use the oval side. I stay in the ball too long. Thanks again-


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 Post subject: Re: Ball Recommendation Mo??
 Posted: Wed Jan 05, 2011 12:44 am Post Number: #12 Post
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AdrienneTurbeville wrote:
Sorry, but I am not sure what you mean by my full spans. The measurements I provided are the cuts. If you let me know how to measure that you need, I can do that.

Yes, I use inserts. Turbo 2-n-1 quads, I use the oval side. I stay in the ball too long. Thanks again-

For clarification:
http://wiki.bowlingchat.net/wiki/index.php?title=Span

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 Post subject: Re: Ball Recommendation Mo??
 Posted: Wed Jan 05, 2011 3:10 am Post Number: #13 Post
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Thank you, this was very helpful and I can see why the distinction is important. It appears that the measurements that I provided from my drill sheet are in fact the full span. I did measure a ball and came up with a 1/16 longer on each finger. Not sure if that can be attributed to the difference in rulers or not?

Here are the measurements:
Middle finger: 4 1/4 (from drill sheet) 4 5/16 current measurement
Ring finger: 4 3/8 (from drill sheet) 4 7/16 current measurement


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 Post subject: Re: Ball Recommendation Mo??
 Posted: Wed Jan 05, 2011 4:00 pm Post Number: #14 Post
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AdrienneTurbeville wrote:
Thank you, this was very helpful and I can see why the distinction is important. It appears that the measurements that I provided from my drill sheet are in fact the full span. I did measure a ball and came up with a 1/16 longer on each finger. Not sure if that can be attributed to the difference in rulers or not?

Here are the measurements:
Middle finger: 4 1/4 (from drill sheet) 4 5/16 current measurement
Ring finger: 4 3/8 (from drill sheet) 4 7/16 current measurement


PM me with your contact info. I think we should finish this discussion on the phone. Look forward to talking to you.


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