I've totally lost reaction on my house shot (long)

Which layout is right for me?

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Mongo
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I've totally lost reaction on my house shot (long)

Post by Mongo » April 16th, 2019, 12:15 pm

Up until about mid-March, season was going well. I had a good grasp on what was going on, but for the last 4 weeks it's gone in the toilet. Ball won't corner, I've got hang that I didn't have before, and haven't been close.

House is super sensitive to temperature changes and this year is worse than ever. Mids feel like they are hooking at 30 feet, but balling down doesn't work because there is still enough volume that cover won't make it.

Currently my bag consists of this
Magnitude 035 (old faithful) - 4 x 50 (4000)
Poison - 4 x 45 (3000)
Turmoil - 4.5 x 60 (3000)
Cutting Edge - 4.5 x 60 (1000 w/compound)
Conspiracy - 70 x 4.5 x 50 (3000)
Ridiculous Pearl - 3.5 x 50 (2000 w/polish)

I've got a ton of other stuff on the ball rack, but this is what I've had success with. In the past, I've really never liked anything with a VAL under 40, just too much, but given what I'm seeing right now, I think I need the extra length/pop. Also, I've tried more than a few and they all do the same thing (burn up, flat corner)

Here's what I've got available
Beyond Ridiculous
Real One
Diva Style
Turmoil Solid
Turmoil Hybrid

Another option I have is to move out into the dirt and just play dead up the dry. I've got a Nitrous I can punch out and try that, too.

Specs (I'd say Eric knows these by now)
RPM - 375-400
Speed - 17.5 - 18.5
Axis tilt - 7
Rotation - 55

I'm open to any suggestions as this is driving me batty. Lane play ideas aren't out of the question, either.
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JMerrell wrote:Mongo,
We need to work on getting that teddy bear body of yours more open throughout the approach.

b3y0nd3r
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Re: I've totally lost reaction on my house shot (long)

Post by b3y0nd3r » April 16th, 2019, 1:33 pm

I have played on this condition and it is by far the worst. Dry mids with slicker backends make it so difficult to navigate.

First, if you haven't done so, sweat the oil out of your balls. Oil saturation is the biggest reason for lost ball reaction. Sometimes multiple treatments are needed.

Second, with your speed, a high diff ball(.050+) with a high RG(2.50+) will give you later ball reaction with a hard snap at the end. 3000 grit is fine.

Lastly, you can use some techniques to try to combat it.

Lob it. I know, it's not the most consistent nor accepted way, but it's just an option.

Move up on the approach to try to shorten your time on the lane surface(use a ball with a sharp back end)

Try a straighter outside shot(ride the gutter)

A urethane ball might be an option here but it would be a straight angular shot(standing far left or right(depending on your dominant hand)). Basically, the ball would glide through the heads, begin to hook at the mids, then skid in the back end. If the angle is right with your speed you should get a better reaction than you have been getting..

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Mongo
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Re: I've totally lost reaction on my house shot (long)

Post by Mongo » April 16th, 2019, 1:47 pm

b3y0nd3r wrote:I have played on this condition and it is by far the worst. Dry mids with slicker backends make it so difficult to navigate.

First, if you haven't done so, sweat the oil out of your balls. Oil saturation is the biggest reason for lost ball reaction. Sometimes multiple treatments are needed.
Flat corners and buckets....all day long.

I've been suffering this for a month, so I've tried a bit. Funny thing is that I shot 300 in city tournament this weekend. Then, I promptly followed that with a 205-195 with umpteen flat 7 pins.
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JMerrell wrote:Mongo,
We need to work on getting that teddy bear body of yours more open throughout the approach.

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Mongo
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Re: I've totally lost reaction on my house shot (long)

Post by Mongo » April 16th, 2019, 1:49 pm

b3y0nd3r wrote:I have played on this condition and it is by far the worst. Dry mids with slicker backends make it so difficult to navigate.

First, if you haven't done so, sweat the oil out of your balls. Oil saturation is the biggest reason for lost ball reaction. Sometimes multiple treatments are needed.


Ball maintenance isn't an issue. :)
Second, with your speed, a high diff ball(.050+) with a high RG(2.50+) will give you later ball reaction with a hard snap at the end. 3000 grit is fine.
I've got a Poison 4 x 50 (3000), but even that surface tends to read too quickly
Lastly, you can use some techniques to try to combat it.

Lob it. I know, it's not the most consistent nor accepted way, but it's just an option.
Tried it, flat corner
Move up on the approach to try to shorten your time on the lane surface(use a ball with a sharp back end)

If I ball down, it won't read. Slow it down too much and it's over under.
Try a straighter outside shot(ride the gutter)
Here's the weird part, if I play straight up the ditch it changes direction almost immediately. It's sandpaper out there, but if I swing it there, it hangs.
A urethane ball might be an option here but it would be a straight angular shot(standing far left or right(depending on your dominant hand)). Basically, the ball would glide through the heads, begin to hook at the mids, then skid in the back end. If the angle is right with your speed you should get a better reaction than you have been getting..
Flat corners and buckets....all day long.

I've been suffering this for a month, so I've tried a bit. Funny thing is that I shot 300 in city tournament this weekend. Then, I promptly followed that with a 205-195 with umpteen flat 7 pins.
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JMerrell wrote:Mongo,
We need to work on getting that teddy bear body of yours more open throughout the approach.

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Re: I've totally lost reaction on my house shot (long)

Post by MegaMav » April 16th, 2019, 1:57 pm

Try playing the house shot more front to back without using the dry.
Use touch to get the ball to go thru the pins the right way, roll the ball.
The look will be more consistent because nobody does that.
My laydown point and breakpoint stay inside of 10.

You're sacrificing margin of error for consistency of the lane.
“When you prepare for everything, you’re ready for anything.” - Bill Walsh

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Mongo
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Re: I've totally lost reaction on my house shot (long)

Post by Mongo » April 16th, 2019, 2:01 pm

MegaMav wrote:Try playing the house shot more front to back without using the dry.
Use touch to get the ball to go thru the pins the right way, roll the ball.
The look will be more consistent because nobody does that.
My laydown point and breakpoint stay inside of 10.

You're sacrificing margin of error for consistency of the lane.
Kind of what I'm thinking given what I'm seeing. I'm leaning towards finding something I can play straight up the oil lane and take the hang out of play.

Carry will go down a hair because I'll lose downlane angle, but ti's better than shooting 620-630 every week.
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JMerrell wrote:Mongo,
We need to work on getting that teddy bear body of yours more open throughout the approach.

User avatar
Mongo
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Joined: March 13th, 2014, 5:33 am
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Preferred Company: DV8/Radical

Re: I've totally lost reaction on my house shot (long)

Post by Mongo » April 18th, 2019, 3:30 am

So, I watched some old video and compared that to recent shots I've taken. Somehow my ball speed had crept up from 17-17.5 to almost 19. Wasn't anything conscious, but I was definitely piping it down there.

I went out this afternoon and threw it as slow as humanly possible to try to get things under control. After about an hour, it clicked in and my ball reaction came back.

Of course, I did this all after I got mad in the morning a punched up a Beyond Ridiculous I had sitting on the wall. I put a layout on it I've never tried (80 x 5 x 30).

The good news is the combination of a little softer speed and a new layout gave me the motion I hadn't seen in a long time. The result....247-246-279.

It turns out, sometimes it's not the ball....but the right ball helps.
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JMerrell wrote:Mongo,
We need to work on getting that teddy bear body of yours more open throughout the approach.

User avatar
Mongo
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Preferred Company: DV8/Radical

Re: I've totally lost reaction on my house shot (long)

Post by Mongo » April 18th, 2019, 9:40 pm

Turns out I've been laying my balls out completely wrong. My "fear" of lower VAL angels was most likely a bad matchup of drill angles and pin position.

I was so impressed with the reaction I got out of that Beyond, that I put it on a Diva Style I had picked up cheap. This 80 x 5 x 30 is magic on my local house shot.


804 out of the box.

Well, that only took more balls than I care to mention to figure out.
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JMerrell wrote:Mongo,
We need to work on getting that teddy bear body of yours more open throughout the approach.

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