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 Post subject: Arsenal for competitive conditions (ECC)
 Posted: Fri Aug 31, 2018 6:33 pm Post Number: #1 Post
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Dear Members,

I would like ask for your help for creating a new arsenal for me.
I was lucky enough to win the national qualification tournament and now I will be representing my country on the European Champions Cup this oktober.
My arsenal is ancient, and I was thinking to build a new arsenal for some time now, but this win gave me the push to move on.

I will try to give you my specs as best as I can and provide any info you might need.
I would prefer to drill one ball at a time, give you feedback and then move on with the next one.

Right hand
Speed: 2,5 seconds on average from release til the first pin - my friend says its appr. 25 km/h or 15,5 mph (don't have a speedmeter in my center)
Pap: 5 1/2 right, 1/2 up
Axis Rot: around 45 but can alter it slightly if needed
Axis Tilt: 17
Rpm: around 300-325

For verification/comparison there is a slow motion video on youtube from the AMF world cup from 2014,
2014 QubicaAMf Bowling World Cup
Video of the various styles from male bowlers
https://youtu.be/1HFJfrd_Kl4

My shot is from 2:30. Don't know if it helps or not.
I can upload a normal video somewhere if needed, but the quality will be what my mobile can make.

There is a list of balls i have available, mostly Radical and Brunswick from the recent year(s) and some relics :) (all undrilled)

#15
Dv8 Pitbull Growl
Radical Ridicolous x2
Radical Ridicolous Pearl
Radical Guru Supreme
Radical Jackpot
Radical Tremendous x2
Radical Tremendous Pearl x 2
Radical Grease Monkey Whack
Brunswick Danger Zone Vintage
Brunswick Fanatic Btu Pearl
Brunswick Slingshot
Brunswick Lethal Revolver
Brunswick Bvp Wizard
Brunswick Bvp Rampage
Track Hx10
Storm Pitch Black


I would like to make an arsenal for competitive conditions, i think they will use something from the Worldbowling patterns. Don't know the length range yet.

Thank you for you time,
Gery


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 Post subject: Re: Arsenal for competitive conditions (ECC)
 Posted: Fri Aug 31, 2018 11:22 pm Post Number: #2 Post
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huntweener wrote:
Dear Members,

I would like ask for your help for creating a new arsenal for me.
I was lucky enough to win the national qualification tournament and now I will be representing my country on the European Champions Cup this oktober.
My arsenal is ancient, and I was thinking to build a new arsenal for some time now, but this win gave me the push to move on.

I will try to give you my specs as best as I can and provide any info you might need.
I would prefer to drill one ball at a time, give you feedback and then move on with the next one.

Right hand
Speed: 2,5 seconds on average from release til the first pin - my friend says its appr. 25 km/h or 15,5 mph (don't have a speedmeter in my center)
Pap: 5 1/2 right, 1/2 up
Axis Rot: around 45 but can alter it slightly if needed
Axis Tilt: 17
Rpm: around 300-325

For verification/comparison there is a slow motion video on youtube from the AMF world cup from 2014,
2014 QubicaAMf Bowling World Cup
Video of the various styles from male bowlers
https://youtu.be/1HFJfrd_Kl4

My shot is from 2:30. Don't know if it helps or not.
I can upload a normal video somewhere if needed, but the quality will be what my mobile can make.

There is a list of balls i have available, mostly Radical and Brunswick from the recent year(s) and some relics :) (all undrilled)

#15
Dv8 Pitbull Growl
Radical Ridicolous x2
Radical Ridicolous Pearl
Radical Guru Supreme
Radical Jackpot
Radical Tremendous x2
Radical Tremendous Pearl x 2
Radical Grease Monkey Whack
Brunswick Danger Zone Vintage
Brunswick Fanatic Btu Pearl
Brunswick Slingshot
Brunswick Lethal Revolver
Brunswick Bvp Wizard
Brunswick Bvp Rampage
Track Hx10
Storm Pitch Black


I would like to make an arsenal for competitive conditions, i think they will use something from the Worldbowling patterns. Don't know the length range yet.

Thank you for you time,
Gery

Unfortunately slow motion video doesn't help with speed calculations.
Speed 2.5 seconds for 60 feet. That is 24 ft/sec. 1440 ft/min. 86,400 ft/hr. divided by 5280 feet in a mile = 16.36 mph. That is an average speed. Off the hand is closer to 18 mph. You are very close to matched speed to revs.

Benchmark 1.25:1 Ratio 95* Total

Asymmetrical layouts ...
Totally Strong ............. 50-4.5-25
Midlane ...................... 35-4.5-40
Benchmark ................. 50-4-45
Long and Strong .......... 70-4-45
Control ....................... 50-3.5-65
low flare ..................... 70-2.25-45

Symmetrical Layouts ... Drilling angle measured to the thumb hole.
Benchmark ................. 85-4-40
Control ...................... 90-4.5-60 (adjust to pin in the ring finger)
low flare .................... 80-5-35

The above lists are a starting point to work from when figuring out your arsenal.

How many balls will your arsenal consist of?

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Eric Hartwell

Right Handed
PAP 4.75" up 1/2"
45* rotation
12* tilt
330 rev rate
16 mph off hand


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 Post subject: Re: Arsenal for competitive conditions (ECC)
 Posted: Sat Sep 01, 2018 1:08 am Post Number: #3 Post
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Could start with a Tremendous as an asymmetrical benchmark and a Ridiculous as a symmetrical benchmark and adjust the other two redundant balls from there... what do you think Eric? This could be a good start.


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 Post subject: Re: Arsenal for competitive conditions (ECC)
 Posted: Sat Sep 01, 2018 1:23 am Post Number: #4 Post
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TonyPR wrote:
Could start with a Tremendous as an asymmetrical benchmark and a Ridiculous as a symmetrical benchmark and adjust the other two redundant balls from there... what do you think Eric? This could be a good start.


Definitely agree.
I love my 50 x 4.75 x 75 Tremendous for most competitive patterns.
I have 17* tilt and 45-70* Rotation. Matched player with soft speed. 15 on monitor.


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 Post subject: Re: Arsenal for competitive conditions (ECC)
 Posted: Sat Sep 01, 2018 3:47 am Post Number: #5 Post
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I was thinking along the same line. With 2 each of the Tremendous and Tremendous pearl I like the idea of having one of each with the Benchmark layout. Leaving the other pair for sport layouts.

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Right Handed
PAP 4.75" up 1/2"
45* rotation
12* tilt
330 rev rate
16 mph off hand


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 Post subject: Re: Arsenal for competitive conditions (ECC)
 Posted: Sun Sep 02, 2018 2:27 pm Post Number: #6 Post
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Thank you for your input so far.

I usually carry around 6 balls including a spareball, so definitely need at least 5 but could be more.

I was at another center in Bratislava, new lanes 41 foot pattern with more than 25 ml volume on Amf surface, my 1 st ball average speed on monitor was 24,5 km/h.

I liked the video, my shot does seem to be similar (on better days :D )

So you suggest to drill a Tremendous and a Ridiculous with the Benchmark layout EricHartwell wrote in his first reply?
If I want to use turbo switch grip, does it change anything?

The lanes I practice on have Brunswick surface with a Brunswick oiling machine, would you suggest a pattern to try it on?

What site do you prefer where I can upload videos?

Thank you,
Gery


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 Post subject: Re: Arsenal for competitive conditions (ECC)
 Posted: Sun Sep 02, 2018 3:45 pm Post Number: #7 Post
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huntweener wrote:
Thank you for your input so far.

I usually carry around 6 balls including a spareball, so definitely need at least 5 but could be more.

I was at another center in Bratislava, new lanes 41 foot pattern with more than 25 ml volume on Amf surface, my 1 st ball average speed on monitor was 24,5 km/h.

I liked the video, my shot does seem to be similar (on better days :D )

So you suggest to drill a Tremendous and a Ridiculous with the Benchmark layout EricHartwell wrote in his first reply?
If I want to use turbo switch grip, does it change anything?

The lanes I practice on have Brunswick surface with a Brunswick oiling machine, would you suggest a pattern to try it on?

What site do you prefer where I can upload videos?

Thank you,
Gery

Youtube works great for uploading video to view here.

Using the Switchgrips changes nothing and your confirmation of speed on the monitors confirms my evaluation of your speed to rev relationship.

The Benchmark layout is a strong layout mainly due to the high flaring pin position. More times than not it will be for the fresh condition when used on a ball with a dull surface. Thus my recommendation to have a choice to compare to to put it on 2 balls with the same core but different coverstock. This will show how different the covers are and aid in the decision to drill the other Tremendous' with tuned layouts be it sport layout or otherwise. Tony's suggestion was to put the Benchmark on the Ridiculous to also have a Symmetrical Benchmark for comparison as well. It wouldn't hurt to start with a 3rd ball and it is a great idea to see how the Symmetrical compares in this group. I realized you wanted to take it slower with one ball at a time. Having 3 to start with allows you to roll each on the same exact lane condition for best comparison.
I can see you drilling at least 10 balls out of your collection to pick your traveling 6 ball set from. What 6 you pick will be based on the lane condition you are going to face. You obviously won't pick your long oil balls to bowl on shorter patterns and vice versa.

As for a pattern to try it on I would suggest something in the med length 39-42 feet in length. The Benchmark is too strong with left to right motion for shorter patterns.

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Eric Hartwell

Right Handed
PAP 4.75" up 1/2"
45* rotation
12* tilt
330 rev rate
16 mph off hand


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 Post subject: Re: Arsenal for competitive conditions (ECC)
 Posted: Mon Sep 03, 2018 11:59 am Post Number: #8 Post
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Ok, thank you!
I will than commence with the drilling this week and report back when i had the opportunity to try them on the lanes.

Have a nice day!

Gery


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 Post subject: Re: Arsenal for competitive conditions (ECC)
 Posted: Mon Sep 03, 2018 5:08 pm Post Number: #9 Post
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Just a quick question:
The two radical Tremendous' have their cg on the left and right from the Pin to mass bias line, leaving me either with less than one ounce or two and quarter positive side weight. Which should I take for the benchmark drilling?

Thanks,
Gery


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 Post subject: Re: Arsenal for competitive conditions (ECC)
 Posted: Mon Sep 03, 2018 5:41 pm Post Number: #10 Post
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huntweener wrote:
Just a quick question:
The two radical Tremendous' have their cg on the left and right from the Pin to mass bias line, leaving me either with less than one ounce or two and quarter positive side weight. Which should I take for the benchmark drilling?

Thanks,
Gery

What about finger/thumb weight?
The one that results in 2 1/4oz of side weight will make for tuning with balance hole an option.

Are you affected by the new rules of the USBC eliminating the use of balance holes?

The one with the Cg out to the left will be a better candidate for the sport layouts that have smaller drilling angles.

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Eric Hartwell

Right Handed
PAP 4.75" up 1/2"
45* rotation
12* tilt
330 rev rate
16 mph off hand


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 Post subject: Re: Arsenal for competitive conditions (ECC)
 Posted: Wed Sep 05, 2018 5:59 pm Post Number: #11 Post
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We will have slight fingerweight with both balls, cg will fall around 1/2 above the midplane(?)

I will check worldbowling's website, but i guess Usbc's rules will apply to the tournament.

I will take then the ball with more sideweight for the benchmark ball.

Thank you!
Gery


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 Post subject: Re: Arsenal for competitive conditions (ECC)
 Posted: Mon Sep 10, 2018 9:14 am Post Number: #12 Post
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Hello I have tried just a few shots on a Brunswick Inferno Oil pattern with the Tremendous drilled with the Benchmark layout (50-4-45) - at the moment without a balance hole.
I had a match against another Team, so i couldn't test it thoroughly, but obviously the Ball was too much with its OOB surface. :)
I would need extra speed to get it through the midlanes :)

I will ask for a different pattern and try this week, and try to shoot some videos.
What will be the next one, because i got confused if the other Benchmark ball should be the Tremendous Pearl or the Ridiculous?

Thanks,
Gery


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 Post subject: Re: Arsenal for competitive conditions (ECC)
 Posted: Mon Sep 10, 2018 11:49 pm Post Number: #13 Post
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huntweener wrote:
Hello I have tried just a few shots on a Brunswick Inferno Oil pattern with the Tremendous drilled with the Benchmark layout (50-4-45) - at the moment without a balance hole.
I had a match against another Team, so i couldn't test it thoroughly, but obviously the Ball was too much with its OOB surface. :)
I would need extra speed to get it through the midlanes :)

I will ask for a different pattern and try this week, and try to shoot some videos.
What will be the next one, because i got confused if the other Benchmark ball should be the Tremendous Pearl or the Ridiculous?

Thanks,
Gery

I would want to see the shiny Tremendous Pearl drilled next and roll it on the same condition with the dull solid. Now you can compare. Feedback from the Benchmarks is how you adjust your arsenal and build around them.

The Benchmark is a Strong reaction.

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Right Handed
PAP 4.75" up 1/2"
45* rotation
12* tilt
330 rev rate
16 mph off hand


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 Post subject: Re: Arsenal for competitive conditions (ECC)
 Posted: Tue Sep 11, 2018 3:28 am Post Number: #14 Post
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Ridiculous could be the long and strong.


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 Post subject: Re: Arsenal for competitive conditions (ECC)
 Posted: Wed Sep 19, 2018 9:53 am Post Number: #15 Post
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Hi just a quick report, I have both the Tremendous and the Pearl with the Benchmark layout drilled, without a balance for now.

I have a few games with them, some on a the Absolute control 1 pattern, which is a recreational pattern and yesterday on the Mexico City pattern from the Worldbowlng official patterns.
The Tremendous is quite strong with the oob surface, the Pearl is more touchy , especially on the inside line.

I have made three videos yesterday which i uploaded here:
https://www.youtube.com/user/huntweener
I am not satisfied with the quality (not to mention my style LOL) so i didn't made more.
I will try to get my tablet put it on a stand, closer to foul line, so maybe you can judge the reaction better.
What lines on what patterns you would like to see? Should i put anything on the ball like tape or anything?

Regards,
Gery


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 Post subject: Re: Arsenal for competitive conditions (ECC)
 Posted: Sun Sep 30, 2018 8:19 pm Post Number: #16 Post
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huntweener wrote:
Hi just a quick report, I have both the Tremendous and the Pearl with the Benchmark layout drilled, without a balance for now.

I have a few games with them, some on a the Absolute control 1 pattern, which is a recreational pattern and yesterday on the Mexico City pattern from the Worldbowlng official patterns.
The Tremendous is quite strong with the oob surface, the Pearl is more touchy , especially on the inside line.

I have made three videos yesterday which i uploaded here:
https://www.youtube.com/user/huntweener
I am not satisfied with the quality (not to mention my style LOL) so i didn't made more.
I will try to get my tablet put it on a stand, closer to foul line, so maybe you can judge the reaction better.
What lines on what patterns you would like to see? Should i put anything on the ball like tape or anything?

Regards,
Gery

You could mark you ball like in this video...
http://wiki.bowlingchat.net/wiki/index. ... t_%26_Revs

In your videos both balls were too strong for the srtaight up the outside line. This does not surprise me. The Benchmark is a strong layout and the Tremendous' are strong balls. You did have a good look when you played the inside line. While this may not be your comfort zone it is the preferred way to play Mexico City.

Now to the next balls to be drilled.

Ridiculous as a Long and Strong ...... 85-4-40
Radical Guru Supreme low flare ....... 70-2.25-45

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Eric Hartwell

Right Handed
PAP 4.75" up 1/2"
45* rotation
12* tilt
330 rev rate
16 mph off hand


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