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 Post subject: Low Flare Layout Advice
 Posted: Wed Jun 27, 2018 8:56 pm Post Number: #1 Post
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Looking to drill a low flare ball for a girl I coach. She is very Rev dominant with a speed of around 14 off her hand, high axis tilt, slightly high axis rotation. With this combination, pretty much everything I've drilled for her is Control, often with a P1 hole. She gets the ball down the lane pretty well, but once it starts moving, it really moves. I'm thinking about going Low Flare with something with a lower differential like a Tropical Breeze. Mo's Low Flare suggestion would be 90x2.5x45. I'm wondering two things: firstly, would it be better to go with a 5.5 pin to PAP distance to delay the hook further, and would the 45 VAL angle still be too low considering how she throws the ball?

I am open to any suggestion, layout, ball, surface, anything. Thanks in advance.


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 Post subject: Re: Low Flare Layout Advice
 Posted: Wed Jun 27, 2018 10:41 pm Post Number: #2 Post
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What kind of ball motion are you look to get for her.
While your description of her bowling style paints a picture specific release specs are needed to give you an accurate layout for her.

Check out this link for the needed information...
viewtopic.php?f=15&t=373

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PAP 4.75" up 1/2"
45* rotation
12* tilt
330 rev rate
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 Post subject: Re: Low Flare Layout Advice
 Posted: Thu Jun 28, 2018 12:54 am Post Number: #3 Post
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EricHartwell wrote:
What kind of ball motion are you look to get for her.
While your description of her bowling style paints a picture specific release specs are needed to give you an accurate layout for her.

Check out this link for the needed information...
viewtopic.php?f=15&t=373


Right, sorry about that:

Speed: 14 off her hand
Rev Rate: 380-400
Initial Axis Rotation: 65
Initial Axis Tilt: 8.3 (12.25 inches)

I'm looking for a very arcy motion. Not snappy at all.


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 Post subject: Re: Low Flare Layout Advice
 Posted: Thu Jun 28, 2018 6:50 pm Post Number: #4 Post
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Tropical will provide "artificial" length and over/under on fresh, regardless of the layout. Recommend 500/2000 surface and a strong, flare-safe pin position for this ball design. ie: 75x3.75x25

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AT: 7º


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 Post subject: Re: Low Flare Layout Advice
 Posted: Fri Jun 29, 2018 2:59 am Post Number: #5 Post
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lpc300 wrote:

Right, sorry about that:

Speed: 14 off her hand
Rev Rate: 380-400
Initial Axis Rotation: 65
Initial Axis Tilt: 8.3 (12.25 inches)

I'm looking for a very arcy motion. Not snappy at all.

Definitely Rev Dominant.

I would like to recommend a layout with a balance hole, But....
With that said I would not recommend such a weak cored ball.
Asymmetrical ball 65-3-65

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PAP 4.75" up 1/2"
45* rotation
12* tilt
330 rev rate
16 mph off hand


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 Post subject: Re: Low Flare Layout Advice
 Posted: Fri Jun 29, 2018 4:23 am Post Number: #6 Post
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EricHartwell wrote:
Definitely Rev Dominant.

I would like to recommend a layout with a balance hole, But....
With that said I would not recommend such a weak cored ball.
Asymmetrical ball 65-3-65


Thanks for responding, Eric. A few questions:

1) I'm curious... Ive always thought that because of her Rev Dominance, a weaker core would help soften her backend reaction. Is tha "theory" of mine incorrect?

2) I have an old DV8 Rukus Feud. Would that core be too strong?

3) If I go with the Rukus, how would you suggest I tweek the surface? I'm thinking OOB might be too strong.

4) Wouldn't a 3" pin-PAP distance still create too much flare?

I appreciate any suggestions.


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 Post subject: Re: Low Flare Layout Advice
 Posted: Fri Jun 29, 2018 7:27 am Post Number: #7 Post
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On a strong asymmetrical ball, I would consider Mo's short pin layout. here is the video:
As far as the finish, do not use skip a grit. Go through all the grits you can and finish with a worn out 4000 at least. skip a grit can be snappy. Going through all grits is more controllable.



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 Post subject: Re: Low Flare Layout Advice
 Posted: Fri Jun 29, 2018 9:23 am Post Number: #8 Post
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elgavachon wrote:
On a strong asymmetrical ball, I would consider Mo's short pin layout. here is the video:
As far as the finish, do not use skip a grit. Go through all the grits you can and finish with a worn out 4000 at least. skip a grit can be snappy. Going through all grits is more controllable.



Thank you. Yeah, I never use skip a grit for her... makes the ball far too snappy. I'm thinking that the short pin layout is the way to go. I've used it on symmetricals with her with varying success.

Do you think some Black Magic polish would be a good idea, to calm down the reaction even more?


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 Post subject: Re: Low Flare Layout Advice
 Posted: Fri Jun 29, 2018 10:11 am Post Number: #9 Post
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lpc300 wrote:

Right, sorry about that:

Speed: 14 off her hand
Rev Rate: 380-400
Initial Axis Rotation: 65
Initial Axis Tilt: 8.3 (12.25 inches)

I'm looking for a very arcy motion. Not snappy at all.

Hi, have you got any video of her bowling? I'm curious as to how she gets 400rpm at 14mph off her hand.

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