Board index » Mo & Friends » Ball & Layout Advice




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 9 posts ] 
Author Message
 Post subject: No balance hole alternatives
 Posted: Sat May 26, 2018 6:45 pm Post Number: #1 Post
Offline
Member

Joined: December 21, 2013
Posts: 110
Location: Michigan
Reputation: 0
Reputation Power: 1
If you want a smaller drill angle, it usually meant needing a balance hole to get the static weight right. With no balance hole any more, how do you get the smaller drill angle effect? Thanks!

_________________
Left Handed, Stroker, 15 lb
PAP 4.7" up 1/2"
~65* rotation
~18* tilt
250-260 RPM
14-15 mph off hand

Benchmark Layout: 45 x 4 x 45


Top 
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: No balance hole alternatives
 Posted: Sat May 26, 2018 7:10 pm Post Number: #2 Post
Offline
BCU Graduate Layouts
User avatar

Joined: April 4, 2011
Posts: 3239
Location: Michigan
Reputation: 279
Reputation Power: 3
todvan wrote:
If you want a smaller drill angle, it usually meant needing a balance hole to get the static weight right. With no balance hole any more, how do you get the smaller drill angle effect? Thanks!

Buy an Asymmetrical ball.

_________________
Eric Hartwell

Right Handed
PAP 4.75" up 1/2"
45* rotation
12* tilt
330 rev rate
16 mph off hand


Top 
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: No balance hole alternatives
 Posted: Sat May 26, 2018 9:34 pm Post Number: #3 Post
Offline
Certified Coach
User avatar

Joined: August 4, 2010
Posts: 338
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Reputation: 192
Reputation Power: 2
todvan wrote:
If you want a smaller drill angle, it usually meant needing a balance hole to get the static weight right. With no balance hole any more, how do you get the smaller drill angle effect? Thanks!

With the allowances of 3oz side weight, you should be ok to use smaller drill angles on an asymm ball.

_________________
BCU Graduate - Mastery of Layouts
USBC Silver level coach


Top 
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: No balance hole alternatives
 Posted: Sun May 27, 2018 12:39 am Post Number: #4 Post
Offline
Member

Joined: December 21, 2013
Posts: 110
Location: Michigan
Reputation: 0
Reputation Power: 1
But for people who need lower ratios and smaller angle sums, symmetric balls are no longer an option ?

_________________
Left Handed, Stroker, 15 lb
PAP 4.7" up 1/2"
~65* rotation
~18* tilt
250-260 RPM
14-15 mph off hand

Benchmark Layout: 45 x 4 x 45


Top 
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: No balance hole alternatives
 Posted: Sun May 27, 2018 4:50 am Post Number: #5 Post
Offline
Member
User avatar

Joined: August 11, 2014
Posts: 554
Reputation: 82
Reputation Power: 1
todvan wrote:
But for people who need lower ratios and smaller angle sums, symmetric balls are no longer an option ?


I guess it depends on how low the ratios and sums need to be.

After drilling a symmetric, the MB/PSA ends up in/near the thumb, so the effective drill angle is fairly large - unless you can stick a big balance hole near the VAL to shift the MB/PSA and reduce the drill angle.

Without that balance hole you may not be able to get the lower sum and ratio you desire. You may still be able to get an early, controllable reaction with surface and using a higher flaring pin position. Or an asym, as recommended.

Steve

_________________
18-19 mph (15.5-16.5 on monitor), 375 rpm, PAP 5 1/2 x 3/8 up, AT: 12*, AR: 45*


Top 
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: No balance hole alternatives
 Posted: Sat Sep 01, 2018 12:30 am Post Number: #6 Post
Offline
Member

Joined: December 21, 2013
Posts: 110
Location: Michigan
Reputation: 0
Reputation Power: 1
Another thought...if the drill angle is measured to the thumb hole, having the pin closer to the PAP would decrease the drill angle somewhat. I wonder if going from a 4” pin to PAP down to a 3” would be worth a try to get the lower angle ratio and sum on a symmetric ball...even though it would flare less.

Otherwise, I am hoping the manufacturers come out with more medium asymmetries at the mid price point....haha, not likely.

_________________
Left Handed, Stroker, 15 lb
PAP 4.7" up 1/2"
~65* rotation
~18* tilt
250-260 RPM
14-15 mph off hand

Benchmark Layout: 45 x 4 x 45


Top 
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: No balance hole alternatives
 Posted: Sat Sep 01, 2018 4:18 am Post Number: #7 Post
Offline
BCU Graduate Layouts
User avatar

Joined: April 4, 2011
Posts: 3239
Location: Michigan
Reputation: 279
Reputation Power: 3
todvan wrote:
Another thought...if the drill angle is measured to the thumb hole, having the pin closer to the PAP would decrease the drill angle somewhat. I wonder if going from a 4” pin to PAP down to a 3” would be worth a try to get the lower angle ratio and sum on a symmetric ball...even though it would flare less.

Otherwise, I am hoping the manufacturers come out with more medium asymmetries at the mid price point....haha, not likely.

Pin to PAP really doesn't change the drilling angle very much. Shorter pin to PAP is actually results in a larger drilling angle and longer Pin to PAP results in smaller drilling angles, about 10 degrees difference.
Smaller VAL angles produce smaller Drilling angles measured to the thumb hole and Larger VAL angles produce larger Drilling angles to the thumb.

Pin to PAP is utilized to manage the amount of flare. Less flare will effectively raise the total angles whereas High flaring positions make the ball act like it has smaller totals.

_________________
Eric Hartwell

Right Handed
PAP 4.75" up 1/2"
45* rotation
12* tilt
330 rev rate
16 mph off hand


Top 
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: No balance hole alternatives
 Posted: Thu Sep 06, 2018 6:15 pm Post Number: #8 Post
Offline
Member

Joined: December 21, 2013
Posts: 110
Location: Michigan
Reputation: 0
Reputation Power: 1
Mo seminar now posted:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=rOOZdetR2Fs

Thinking of avoiding symmetric for anything I buy this year. Need a more medium benchmark reaction from an asymmetric ball. Maybe a Ludicrous?

_________________
Left Handed, Stroker, 15 lb
PAP 4.7" up 1/2"
~65* rotation
~18* tilt
250-260 RPM
14-15 mph off hand

Benchmark Layout: 45 x 4 x 45


Top 
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: No balance hole alternatives
 Posted: Thu Sep 06, 2018 11:46 pm Post Number: #9 Post
Offline
BCU Graduate Layouts
User avatar

Joined: August 31, 2014
Posts: 658
Location: Tucson, AZ
Reputation: 121
Reputation Power: 2
IMO< the reality is that the proportion of asymm sales will increase dramatically, and the net effect of the rule changes will be more or less nil, in terms of pattern stability/longevity.
ie: the goals of the rules changes are based on the assumption that the proportion of asymm/symm sales will not change, and that proshops will not employ trick drilling techniques to achieve higher diffs and happier customers.

_________________
Benchmark Bowling Pro Shop
Byron

RH
PAP: 5.625" x 0
REVRATE: 360
SPEED: 17mph at release
AR: 55º
AT: 7º


Top 
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
 
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 9 posts ] 

Board index » Mo & Friends » Ball & Layout Advice


 
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to: