Cash layout

Which layout is right for me?

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ballspoint
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Cash layout

Post by ballspoint »

I have got myself a Radical Cash, 15lb, 3 3/8 pin, 2.7 top weight.
I would like a suggestion layout for sports/heavy oil patterns please.
My ball speed has dropped maybe 2mph.I could get this rechecked if its helpful.
Cheers.
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elgavachon
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Re: Cash layout

Post by elgavachon »

ballspoint wrote:I have got myself a Radical Cash, 15lb, 3 3/8 pin, 2.7 top weight.
I would like a suggestion layout for sports/heavy oil patterns please.
My ball speed has dropped maybe 2mph.I could get this rechecked if its helpful.
Cheers.
Have you tried 45* 4 1/4" 25* on anything? That would be a strong ball. not neccessarily smooth and control, but it will hook and carry in my opinion
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EricHartwell
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Re: Cash layout

Post by EricHartwell »

ballspoint wrote:I have got myself a Radical Cash, 15lb, 3 3/8 pin, 2.7 top weight.
I would like a suggestion layout for sports/heavy oil patterns please.
My ball speed has dropped maybe 2mph.I could get this rechecked if its helpful.
Cheers.
Have you updated your signature to reflect the 2 mph loss in speed?

For Sport type layouts the Pattern length is important information.
Heavy oil is what the Cash is meant for. Layout for it depends on the length.
elgavachon wrote:Have you tried 45* 4 1/4" 25* on anything? That would be a strong ball. not neccessarily smooth and control, but it will hook and carry in my opinion
Basically the Totally Strong Layout based on speed being 16 mph.
This would be a good example for longer patterns.
Eric Hartwell

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PAP 4.75" up 1/2"
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ballspoint
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Re: Cash layout

Post by ballspoint »

I am getting my ball speed rechecked on Monday with my coach.
Our sports patterns are usually around 43 ft, 4:1 ratio.

I have 50* 3 3/4 35* on my Virtual Gravity Nano, but i usually played 7 board.
Had 35* 4 7/8 40* on Critical Theory pearl, was best on med/long patterns/burn.
I also use surface to get the result needed on any oil pattern.

I assume the cover strenght of the Cash as been considered with the 45* 4 1/4" 25* suggestion?
Will post again with ball speed. cheers
R/H, 20 mph off hand. 250 Revs.
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Re: Cash layout

Post by ballspoint »

Had ball speed checked, came out as avg 20.45, as was filmed 4 times.
My coach mentioned how he came to that, 15 frames, first 15ft, 30 frames per second.
So i assumed my speed had dropped, but actually increased, while doing this i felt comfortable with my approach and coming off my hand.
So with that new ifo, would layout is recommended please.

I add a balance hole after some practise on sports patterns.

New ball speed is now added to my signature.
R/H, 20 mph off hand. 250 Revs.
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EricHartwell
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Positive Axis Point: 4-3/4" and 1/2"up
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Heavy Oil Ball: Radical Tremendous, EVO solid, Hammer Obsession
Medium Oil Ball: EVO pearl, True Motion, Columbia Command, DV8 Intimidator
Light Oil Ball: Blue Hammer
Location: Michigan

Re: Cash layout

Post by EricHartwell »

ballspoint wrote:Had ball speed checked, came out as avg 20.45, as was filmed 4 times.
My coach mentioned how he came to that, 15 frames, first 15ft, 30 frames per second.
So i assumed my speed had dropped, but actually increased, while doing this i felt comfortable with my approach and coming off my hand.
So with that new ifo, would layout is recommended please.

I add a balance hole after some practise on sports patterns.

New ball speed is now added to my signature.
I like to start with the Benchmark and work from there.
Speed dominant with low tilt and high rotation 70* total and 1.3:1 Ratio 40-4.25-30

Asymmetrical layouts for longer patterns
Sport layout ................. 15-5-35 P3
Totally Strong ............... 35-4.5-15 P3
Midlane ........................ 20-4.5-30 P3
Benchmark ................... 40-4.25-30 P2.5
Double Thumb Layout .... 70-4-30 Double thumb hole

I know that is a lot of choices.

I am personally a fan of the Midlane layout.

I suggest discussing these layouts with your Coach.
If you have any questions feel free to keep this discussion going.
Eric Hartwell

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PAP 4.75" up 1/2"
45* rotation
12* tilt
330 rev rate
16 mph off hand
ballspoint
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Re: Cash layout

Post by ballspoint »

EricHartwell wrote: I like to start with the Benchmark and work from there.
Speed dominant with low tilt and high rotation 70* total and 1.3:1 Ratio 40-4.25-30

Asymmetrical layouts for longer patterns
Sport layout ................. 15-5-35 P3
Totally Strong ............... 35-4.5-15 P3
Midlane ........................ 20-4.5-30 P3
Benchmark ................... 40-4.25-30 P2.5
Double Thumb Layout .... 70-4-30 Double thumb hole

I know that is a lot of choices.

I am personally a fan of the Midlane layout.

I suggest discussing these layouts with your Coach.
If you have any questions feel free to keep this discussion going.
That was quick, thank you.
Strong layouts, dont know enough to comment how these will be on the Cash as it is a strong ball, How much does that come into your consideration when suggesting the layouts?
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Re: Cash layout

Post by MegaMav »

I'd do the old MoRich strong midlane layout, personally.
15 x 4 3/4 x 30 + P2 if needed for statics.
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Medium Oil Ball: EVO pearl, True Motion, Columbia Command, DV8 Intimidator
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Re: Cash layout

Post by EricHartwell »

ballspoint wrote:
That was quick, thank you.
Strong layouts, dont know enough to comment how these will be on the Cash as it is a strong ball, How much does that come into your consideration when suggesting the layouts?
For the intended long sport condition a Strong coverstock is basically the only recommendation. If you would have suggstd a weak covered ball I would have recommended against it.

So, Yes the strength of the Cash was definitely considered.
Eric Hartwell

Right Handed
PAP 4.75" up 1/2"
45* rotation
12* tilt
330 rev rate
16 mph off hand
ballspoint
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Re: Cash layout

Post by ballspoint »

Some on this site suggest to resurface a new ball before bowling, Makes alot of sense to me. As i can replicate that at home myself.
As the Cash is Factory Finish: 500, 1500 Siaair Micro Pad,
What would be a reccommened resurface to start with?
R/H, 20 mph off hand. 250 Revs.
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MegaMav
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Rev Rate: 375
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Axis Rotation: 45
Heavy Oil Ball: Radical - Informer
Medium Oil Ball: Brunswick - Fearless
Light Oil Ball: Radical - Bonus Pearl
Preferred Company: Radical Bowling Technologies
Location: Malta, NY

Re: Cash layout

Post by MegaMav »

ballspoint wrote:Some on this site suggest to resurface a new ball before bowling, Makes alot of sense to me. As i can replicate that at home myself.
As the Cash is Factory Finish: 500, 1500 Siaair Micro Pad,
What would be a reccommened resurface to start with?
Play around with different pads until you find the one you like.
The coverstock is very versatile with surfaces.
If I were you I'd start with a 1000 pad by hand.
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Re: Cash layout

Post by ballspoint »

ballspoint wrote:
That was quick, thank you.
Strong layouts, dont know enough to comment how these will be on the Cash as it is a strong ball, How much does that come into your consideration when suggesting the layouts?
I am personally a fan of the Midlane layout.

I am considering the midlane layout, just a question with the pin above the fingers, is this expected?
I thought pin below is for strong drilling, or this is old school? Attached is a link to view and comment please. " onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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EricHartwell
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Positive Axis Point: 4-3/4" and 1/2"up
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Rev Rate: 330
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Axis Rotation: 45
Heavy Oil Ball: Radical Tremendous, EVO solid, Hammer Obsession
Medium Oil Ball: EVO pearl, True Motion, Columbia Command, DV8 Intimidator
Light Oil Ball: Blue Hammer
Location: Michigan

Re: Cash layout

Post by EricHartwell »

ballspoint wrote: I am personally a fan of the Midlane layout.

I am considering the midlane layout, just a question with the pin above the fingers, is this expected?
I thought pin below is for strong drilling, or this is old school? Attached is a link to view and comment please. " onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Yes that is old school thinking.
Pin down is for a longer hook zone that can produce more hook but it also delays the roll. For longer patterns especially on the fresh this makes carrying strikes difficult.
Eric Hartwell

Right Handed
PAP 4.75" up 1/2"
45* rotation
12* tilt
330 rev rate
16 mph off hand
ballspoint
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Speed: 20 mph off the hand
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Axis Rotation: 70

Re: Cash layout

Post by ballspoint »

ballspoint wrote:
That was quick, thank you.
Strong layouts, dont know enough to comment how these will be on the Cash as it is a strong ball, How much does that come into your consideration when suggesting the layouts?
Hi, could you readjust the midlane layout a bit weaker. Couple of reasons, my ball driller/coach is helping me with ball speed and release, so long term these would siut a weaker layout, also i use surface alot to suit the oil pattern. I am getting at a more useable layout with surface for the patterns.
Hope you get what iam trying to say. Thanks.
R/H, 20 mph off hand. 250 Revs.
11* Tilt. 70* Rotation. 5 5/8 x 1"up
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EricHartwell
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Posts: 4080
Joined: April 5th, 2011, 12:24 am
Positive Axis Point: 4-3/4" and 1/2"up
Speed: 16 off hand
Rev Rate: 330
Axis Tilt: 12
Axis Rotation: 45
Heavy Oil Ball: Radical Tremendous, EVO solid, Hammer Obsession
Medium Oil Ball: EVO pearl, True Motion, Columbia Command, DV8 Intimidator
Light Oil Ball: Blue Hammer
Location: Michigan

Re: Cash layout

Post by EricHartwell »

ballspoint wrote:
Hi, could you readjust the midlane layout a bit weaker. Couple of reasons, my ball driller/coach is helping me with ball speed and release, so long term these would siut a weaker layout, also i use surface alot to suit the oil pattern. I am getting at a more useable layout with surface for the patterns.
Hope you get what iam trying to say. Thanks.
Benchmark ................... 40-4.25-30 P2.5
Eric Hartwell

Right Handed
PAP 4.75" up 1/2"
45* rotation
12* tilt
330 rev rate
16 mph off hand
ballspoint
Member
Member
Posts: 300
Joined: August 3rd, 2011, 4:44 am
Speed: 20 mph off the hand
Rev Rate: 250
Axis Tilt: 11
Axis Rotation: 70

Re: Cash layout

Post by ballspoint »

EricHartwell wrote:
Benchmark ................... 40-4.25-30 P2.5
Benchmark drilled, still no balance hole, waiting for some decent oil to find tune it. Went with the benchmark so i can adjust the surface for different oil patterns/volume. Had a bowl on a house pattern just testing the grip and a play, rolls nice an strong, will post again in the new year, thanks for the layouts and time, cheers.
R/H, 20 mph off hand. 250 Revs.
11* Tilt. 70* Rotation. 5 5/8 x 1"up
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