Release
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- scotts33
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- Joined: August 13th, 2009, 12:30 pm
- Positive Axis Point: 4 7/8" > 3/8" up
- Speed: 16 off hand
- Rev Rate: 325
- Axis Tilt: 17
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- Heavy Oil Ball: Motiv T10 LE 60* 4" 60* no hole symm. OOB pin down
- Location: Madison, WI
Release
Paul,
I touched on this in the first topic in your section.
Does it take a consistent release to use asymmetric equipment? Will symmetric equipment allow for more inconsistent releases and cover up a multitude of sins?
Wonder about your take on this.
Scott
I touched on this in the first topic in your section.
Does it take a consistent release to use asymmetric equipment? Will symmetric equipment allow for more inconsistent releases and cover up a multitude of sins?
Wonder about your take on this.
Scott
- purduepaul
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- Preferred Company: Radical Bowling
Re: Release
scotts33 wrote:Paul,
I touched on this in the first topic in your section.
Does it take a consistent release to use asymmetric equipment? Will symmetric equipment allow for more inconsistent releases and cover up a multitude of sins?
Wonder about your take on this.
Scott
Asymmetric equipment in general will have a quicker transition than symmetrical equipment will. However, your pro shop operator should be able to give the control you would like with Asymmetrical equipment by increasing your VAL angle. The higher your VAL angle the longer and smoother your hook zone will be. When I do not have to control the front part of the lane, I generally go to higher VAL angles so the ball does not "jerk" off the spot as hard.
Paul Ridenour
former Sr Research Engineer at USBC
Radical Bowling Technologies Staffer
former Sr Research Engineer at USBC
Radical Bowling Technologies Staffer
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Re: Release
when you say higher val angles, do you mean higher than normal preference, higher as compared to the drilling angle, or high as in 70 degrees and up. I know Mo only recommends 70 as maximum,but I have really good luck with Rico which is a little over 90.
- purduepaul
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- THS Average: 215
- Positive Axis Point: 4 5/8 over by 5/8" up
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- Preferred Company: Radical Bowling
Re: Release
Just the higher in general, meaning the higher the VAL angle the longer and smoother the transition will be. That's why RICO drills are best for wet/dry conditions.elgavachon wrote:when you say higher val angles, do you mean higher than normal preference, higher as compared to the drilling angle, or high as in 70 degrees and up. I know Mo only recommends 70 as maximum,but I have really good luck with Rico which is a little over 90.
Paul Ridenour
former Sr Research Engineer at USBC
Radical Bowling Technologies Staffer
former Sr Research Engineer at USBC
Radical Bowling Technologies Staffer
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Re: Release
do you guys take the rg #s into account when mapping out a ball. for example: at the TAT tournament in Vegas everyone is recieving 2 balls one is the Ebonite EVolve it has an rg of 2.57 and a differential of.057 it is a symetrical factory finished at 1000 . At the Mini-eliminator they are giving the Columbia Full swing. It has an rg of 2.490 and a differential of .056 with an assymetrical core 4000 abrolon. I really like my Mojave at 80 3 1/2 30 but it is a dry lane ball. If I tried that same drill on a ball with texture, would you try it in the evolve with the higher rg or would you take a ball with less texture like the full swing at 4000? I have trouble with length and carry when I move in deep on scorched lanes. would you go with texture? or match rg? or try to use assymetrical since the mojave is assymetrical? I would appreciate any and all thoughts on this.
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Re: Release
I was thinking assymetrical at 80 3 1/2 30 and maybe refinishing or polishing. symetrical like Paul recommended which was 40 3 3/8 35 and hope for a long pin so I could use a wt hole close to imaginary mass bias.
- purduepaul
- Member
- Posts: 219
- Joined: June 26th, 2009, 3:13 am
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- Positive Axis Point: 4 5/8 over by 5/8" up
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- Preferred Company: Radical Bowling
Re: Release
elgavachon wrote:do you guys take the rg #s into account when mapping out a ball. for example: at the TAT tournament in Vegas everyone is recieving 2 balls one is the Ebonite EVolve it has an rg of 2.57 and a differential of.057 it is a symetrical factory finished at 1000 . At the Mini-eliminator they are giving the Columbia Full swing. It has an rg of 2.490 and a differential of .056 with an assymetrical core 4000 abrolon. I really like my Mojave at 80 3 1/2 30 but it is a dry lane ball. If I tried that same drill on a ball with texture, would you try it in the evolve with the higher rg or would you take a ball with less texture like the full swing at 4000? I have trouble with length and carry when I move in deep on scorched lanes. would you go with texture? or match rg? or try to use assymetrical since the mojave is assymetrical? I would appreciate any and all thoughts on this.
Somewhat but I will give you a piece of advice on the Evolve, it is a good ball however add 15 degrees to your normal VAL angle. For an evolve I would go 40 3 3/8 45 for a full swing try a 55 3 3/4 35. You dont need to always stick at box surface, try different things see what works for you.
Paul Ridenour
former Sr Research Engineer at USBC
Radical Bowling Technologies Staffer
former Sr Research Engineer at USBC
Radical Bowling Technologies Staffer
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- Trusted Source
- Posts: 3174
- Joined: January 18th, 2010, 9:21 pm
Re: Release
thanks Paul just curious why would you add 15 degrees to the val on the Evolve? Is that to tame down the back end? Just curious what your reasoning is? also out of curiosity, what is your goal with the full swing 55 3 3/4 35?
- purduepaul
- Member
- Posts: 219
- Joined: June 26th, 2009, 3:13 am
- THS Average: 215
- Positive Axis Point: 4 5/8 over by 5/8" up
- Speed: 19
- Rev Rate: 300
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- Axis Rotation: 65
- Preferred Company: Radical Bowling
Re: Release
No I drilled an evolve and thought personally that I like the transition at 30 degrees and thought for my in had way too quick of a transition...Experience. For the full swing keeping your axis rotation with the 3 3/4" drilling is for a stronger overall ball motion with a solid hard move to the pocket...elgavachon wrote:thanks Paul just curious why would you add 15 degrees to the val on the Evolve? Is that to tame down the back end? Just curious what your reasoning is? also out of curiosity, what is your goal with the full swing 55 3 3/4 35?
Paul Ridenour
former Sr Research Engineer at USBC
Radical Bowling Technologies Staffer
former Sr Research Engineer at USBC
Radical Bowling Technologies Staffer
Re: Release
elgavachon,elgavachon wrote:do you guys take the rg #s into account when mapping out a ball. for example: at the TAT tournament in Vegas everyone is recieving 2 balls one is the Ebonite EVolve it has an rg of 2.57 and a differential of.057 it is a symetrical factory finished at 1000 .
Just so you don't proceed under a false premise, Ebonite lists the Evolve as a mass bias ball with a PSA strength of .015". Not huge, but significant.
See http://ebonite.com/images/uploads/resou ... ve_STs.pdf
Right handed
Speed: 13.5 -14.5 at pin deck
Rev Rate: 275 - 350
Axis rotation: 45*
Axis tilt: 17*
PAP: 5" x 0"
Speed: 13.5 -14.5 at pin deck
Rev Rate: 275 - 350
Axis rotation: 45*
Axis tilt: 17*
PAP: 5" x 0"
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- Joined: January 18th, 2010, 9:21 pm
Re: Release
hey thanks for pointing that out to me. I got my information from http://www.bowlingball.com/ebonite-evol ... -ball.html I don't know why they call it a symetrical ball. I did even look at the picture of the weight block and I did notice the flat sides but I guess It didn't register.
Re: Release
Asymmetric refers to shape. Mass Bias has more to due with weight distribution.elgavachon wrote:hey thanks for pointing that out to me. I got my information from http://www.bowlingball.com/ebonite-evol ... -ball.html I don't know why they call it a symetrical ball. I did even look at the picture of the weight block and I did notice the flat sides but I guess It didn't register.
They can make a symmetric ball have a mass bias by using different densities to create the shape of the core they wish. The most basic symmetric mass bias core might have the 2 halves (identical in shape) be made of one lighter material on one side or half and one heavier or denser material for the other side or half. Thus it would have a symmetric shape but definitely have a mass bias. There have been several symmetric mass bias cores. I don't recall them offhand.
Right handed
Speed: 13.5 -14.5 at pin deck
Rev Rate: 275 - 350
Axis rotation: 45*
Axis tilt: 17*
PAP: 5" x 0"
Speed: 13.5 -14.5 at pin deck
Rev Rate: 275 - 350
Axis rotation: 45*
Axis tilt: 17*
PAP: 5" x 0"