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*NEW* - MOtion Hole - Video - How To & Demonstration

Posted: February 10th, 2013, 5:24 am
by MegaMav
New and exciting things in the world of ball motion.
Below is a 12 minute video describing the Motion Hole.

(This video is now LIVE!)
Available in 1080p HD.

[youtube][/youtube]

I'd like to thank Mo for the opportunity to make a video on this new dynamic layout.
I hope everyone gives it a try, especially on a new Radical bowling ball.

Re: *NEW* - MOtion Hole - Video - How To & Demonstration

Posted: February 10th, 2013, 8:06 am
by guruU2
Bring back the "Observation & Reality" thread: Mo has been spending some time in the "Pin nel zone" again- you know, that "twilight zone" area between hard science and the creative investigation of the given phenomena. ;)

First we had "pin out", "pin in" and "pin nel". Now we have "pin up", "pin down" "pin side" and a "pin nel" hole. Father time is not slowing down Mo nor the other "mad scientist" Carmen Salvino, the "spook" himself. No nursing home for these "old farts" :lol: Just think, they work for the same company now. Lets put them a room together and watch "the creative smarts" runneth over.

Re: *NEW* - MOtion Hole - Video - How To & Demonstration

Posted: February 10th, 2013, 12:06 pm
by scotts33
Thanks for doinjg this Eric! Rory Holland did this and tried to explain it to me. Your video helped explained it much better.

Scott

Re: *NEW* - MOtion Hole - Video - How To & Demonstration

Posted: February 10th, 2013, 3:13 pm
by Bahshay
What would be the consequence of drilling the hole when the pin isn't over the ring or to the side of it?

Re: *NEW* - MOtion Hole - Video - How To & Demonstration

Posted: February 10th, 2013, 4:54 pm
by Triplicate
Thanks to everyone for sharing and all the hard work that went into this.

Was this inspired in part by the Voodoo layout weight hole also around the back of the ball?

I'm going to simulate this for both the less than 5" PAP and greater than 5". I have no idea where this will lead but it should be a fun exercise. I have all the details of my Voodoo layout to compare this with as well.

I'm going to use the exact layout in the video for the less than 5" PAP example and I'll use my specs for the over 5" PAP simulation. Stay tuned.

Any thoughts before I get into this?

Re: *NEW* - MOtion Hole - Video - How To & Demonstration

Posted: February 10th, 2013, 5:31 pm
by distjamb
Triplicate wrote:Thanks to everyone for sharing and all the hard work that went into this.

Was this inspired in part by the Voodoo layout weight hole also around the back of the ball?

I'm going to simulate this for both the less than 5" PAP and greater than 5". I have no idea where this will lead but it should be a fun exercise. I have all the details of my Voodoo layout to compare this with as well.

I'm going to use the exact layout in the video for the less than 5" PAP example and I'll use my specs for the over 5" PAP simulation. Stay tuned.

Any thoughts before I get into this?
That was my first thought was the Voodoo layout. Im curious to see this "mechanical advantage" in your simulation.

Re: *NEW* - MOtion Hole - Video - How To & Demonstration

Posted: February 10th, 2013, 6:24 pm
by xclusix
Awesome! Triplicate, please collect data on entry angle and rolling distance from Blueprint. Also it would be great if you can test this on a speed dominate bowler stats, say 18 MPH and 200 rpm with average rotations and tilt.

Also see what happens if you move that hole around a couple of inches up-down or right-left.

Does anyone have an explanation on why the different distances for asym or sym?

Re: *NEW* - MOtion Hole - Video - How To & Demonstration

Posted: February 10th, 2013, 6:31 pm
by learnmore
is there any way we can get a comparisson between a p4 aggressive, and MOtion hole?

Re: *NEW* - MOtion Hole - Video - How To & Demonstration

Posted: February 10th, 2013, 6:57 pm
by Triplicate
These are already some good thoughts so keep this coming. I'll hold off doing this for a while to collect more of these kind of comments. By doing so I can come up with meeting most of the requests in one session.

Re: *NEW* - MOtion Hole - Video - How To & Demonstration

Posted: February 10th, 2013, 7:19 pm
by J_Mac
xclusix wrote:
Does anyone have an explanation on why the different distances for asym or sym?
My guess is it has to do with the PSA of the ball before drilling the balance hole. The PSA on a symmetric ball isn't as locked in as it is on a strong asymmetric core, thus the 1" shift when laying out one versus the other.

Re: *NEW* - MOtion Hole - Video - How To & Demonstration

Posted: February 11th, 2013, 12:12 am
by MathIsTruth
Triplicate wrote:
Was this inspired in part by the Voodoo layout weight hole also around the back of the ball?
Not in the slightest!

Re: *NEW* - MOtion Hole - Video - How To & Demonstration

Posted: February 11th, 2013, 12:46 am
by MathIsTruth
J_Mac wrote: My guess is it has to do with the PSA of the ball before drilling the balance hole. The PSA on a symmetric ball isn't as locked in as it is on a strong asymmetric core, thus the 1" shift when laying out one versus the other.

The different distances are used because of differences in bowtie locations and track flares between symms and asymms. Results from our core shape studies over the past year or so led us to the idea of using the MOtion Hole technique. We have performed extensive CAD modeling to study the effects on mass properties before applying the technique in person and studying the real world situation with several bowlers. Megamav's video is the first to show the effects of the MOtion Hole. I think it clearly showed the potential of increased ball motion and I thank him for his work, especially on calculating spin times.

Re: *NEW* - MOtion Hole - Video - How To & Demonstration

Posted: February 11th, 2013, 2:34 am
by ICURNVS
For a Asym ball would u draw the line from the marked PSA on the ball or where it spins up on the determinator?

Re: *NEW* - MOtion Hole - Video - How To & Demonstration

Posted: February 11th, 2013, 2:40 am
by MegaMav
ICURNVS wrote:For a Asym ball would u draw the line from the marked PSA on the ball or where it spins up on the determinator?
If you have a determinator, use the PSA from that.
Otherwise, if you dont have a determinator, you'll eventually figure out the hard way that you'll have to move the tape one way or another because the tape keeps thumping on the backend.

In theory the PSA marked should be close, but I've seen some rare ones off by an inch or more.

Re: *NEW* - MOtion Hole - Video - How To & Demonstration

Posted: February 11th, 2013, 2:50 am
by ICURNVS
on under 5" PAP you wanted the pin above the ring finger, just looking at what I have laying around would this layout work?

or is the pin too high.

http://i282.photobucket.com/albums/kk27 ... photo1.jpg" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Re: *NEW* - MOtion Hole - Video - How To & Demonstration

Posted: February 11th, 2013, 2:58 am
by MegaMav
ICURNVS wrote:on under 5" PAP you wanted the pin above the ring finger, just looking at what I have laying around would this layout work?

or is the pin too high.

http://i282.photobucket.com/albums/kk27 ... photo1.jpg" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Draw the line from the Thumb hole to the pin, then extend the line far around the ball.
Measure 10" from the Pin on that line and tape it.
Throw it, then trace the flare and find out.

I have exactly one ball experience with this balance hole location.
Find out, the worst thing that happens is, you waste a piece of tape.

Re: *NEW* - MOtion Hole - Video - How To & Demonstration

Posted: February 11th, 2013, 3:07 am
by RevZiLLa
Would this be overkill on a ball with a Diff ratio of over 50%? Would highly polished pieces tend to be a little too skid snap and squirty with this enhancement?

Nice vid, Eric!

Re: *NEW* - MOtion Hole - Video - How To & Demonstration

Posted: February 11th, 2013, 3:41 am
by KYBOB
:D


Good work Eric :!:

Thanks to Mo, MathIsTruth and everyone else involved. :!: :!: :!:

Re: *NEW* - MOtion Hole - Video - How To & Demonstration

Posted: February 11th, 2013, 4:17 am
by Dustin
Great video. Can't wait to try this out!!

Re: *NEW* - MOtion Hole - Video - How To & Demonstration

Posted: February 11th, 2013, 11:32 am
by magoo
I have tried the MOtion hole on 3 balls(PM,DestroyR,and Mightmare)I had the pleasure about two months ago to try this out with Mo.It was very informative to watch Mo collect his data on the change and effect of adding the hole.
We drilled a PM and then went and found my strike line,marked the flare rings and added a MOtion hole.The next ball was brooklyn.I had to make a 6 and 2 move left.
The DestroyR and Nightmare I have not been able to use successfully due to the fact I am not that consistent playing that far left yet.They are too much ball for a house shot.Looking forward to seeing the reaction on a sport shot this summer.
The hole definetely increases the reaction off the dry.
I would definetely recommend every speed dominate bowler to try this hole.I have around 250 revs with a ball speed of 18-19 mph off my hand and 26* of tilt.
The PM has become the first ball out of my bag.My other PM with a p4 is still too weak for me except on a broke down shot.
Nice video Eric.