How to read the ratios

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fc3
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Positive Axis Point: 5 3/4 x3/8
Speed: 18/19 pindeck
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How to read the ratios

Post by fc3 »

Hello Mr.Mo, Probably is going to sound silly but I'm been studying your method and by the way is GREAT already using it on my shop very happy guests have had bowling guest trowing 300's and 800 series with just a few changes on their old equipment and new also ....but the part that I can not decipher is the ratios to determined the sweet spot to get the layouts I check every day and see the new posts and when I see the explanations there I go again to try to determine how is done I take their axis tilt,rotation, rpm I mean every thing and look it up in the wiki but still can do it ....do not know if you understand my question but when i see a ratio and this is only an example the ratio of 1:1 and then i see that you give the base on that a angle and a pin placement ..wow i look and look over and over but can explained why... well that is why your or the master.

Probably asking to much but if it is possible can you explain how you come with those numbers I'm probably missing something but would like to know so i can delivered great bowling experience to my guests and by the way i do let them know about your system .... cause my biggest problem is that I'm in a small town in California so there is nothing near to attend your seminars .... but for sure i will go next year oh forgot my teacher is Mr. Alex Cortes ...please help with this matter really appreciated thanks
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kellytehuna
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Re: How to read the ratios

Post by kellytehuna »

If you look in the Wiki, under the pro shop section there is a Ratio Guide, which gives you a rough outline as to the ratios you need to use for certain tilt, rotation and rev/speed matches. It's a simple lookup table. It's a little outdated, but it will be enough to get you started on the right path, I think.
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Triplicate
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Re: How to read the ratios

Post by Triplicate »

kellytehuna wrote:If you look in the Wiki, under the pro shop section there is a Ratio Guide, which gives you a rough outline as to the ratios you need to use for certain tilt, rotation and rev/speed matches. It's a simple lookup table. It's a little outdated, but it will be enough to get you started on the right path, I think.
How is it outdated kelly? I'm still working on my spreadsheet.
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kellytehuna
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Positive Axis Point: 3.75", 1" up
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Heavy Oil Ball: Morich DestroyR
Medium Oil Ball: Morich Perpetual Motion
Light Oil Ball: Morich Mojave
Preferred Company: Morich
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Re: How to read the ratios

Post by kellytehuna »

Triplicate wrote: How is it outdated kelly? I'm still working on my spreadsheet.
For lower tilts, the ratios should actually get smaller, especially as rotation get's higher.
Father, Husband, Bowler, Web developer

15lb Morich DestroyR, Mania, Perpetual Motion, Craze, Frenzy, Mojave
15lb Radical Yeti
15lb Brunswick Slingshot, Avalanche Urethane

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elgavachon
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Re: How to read the ratios

Post by elgavachon »

kellytehuna wrote: For lower tilts, the ratios should actually get smaller, especially as rotation get's higher.
there is a special chart at the bottom of the article which handles that.
I think it is a little out dated though because of the super covers. Mo seems to be using higher ratios with them and higher totals sometimes.
If you move the matched column one column to the left though everything falls into place again.
Last edited by elgavachon on July 20th, 2011, 9:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: How to read the ratios

Post by elgavachon »

kellytehuna wrote: For lower tilts, the ratios should actually get smaller, especially as rotation get's higher.
there is a special chart at the bottom of the article which handles that. (click on LOW TILT CHART at bottom of the article it will redirect you to a PDF )
I think it is a little out dated though because of the super covers. Mo seems to be using higher ratios with them and higher totals sometimes.
If you move the matched column one to the left though then everything falls into place again.
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fc3
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Positive Axis Point: 5 3/4 x3/8
Speed: 18/19 pindeck
Rev Rate: 350
Axis Tilt: 10
Axis Rotation: 60
Heavy Oil Ball: ALPHA MAX
Medium Oil Ball: 4.5 C SYSTEM RICO LAYOUT
Light Oil Ball: karma
Preferred Company: leos pro shop

Re: How to read the ratios

Post by fc3 »

I know Mr. Gabachon you posted the chart the chart is no t the problem where im confussed is to get the magic numbers eg.
speed dominant, with low tilt and medium rotation. I get 100°±20°, 2.25:1-1.25:1 and pins of 2.5"-4" asym and 3"-5" sym.

Your benchmarks come out at:
60° / 3.25" / 40° asym
65° / 3.25" / 35° sym
I copied this from a previous post ....
How do you do the math is it 2.25-(1-1.25) or 2.25+1 seeing the eg. of 2.25:1 does that give you the pin of 3.25 and 2.25+ (1-1.25)=2.50 for the pin just confused sorry ...
the rest I do how to get the numbers is just that little part of math that is bothering me thanks :?:
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Re: How to read the ratios

Post by elgavachon »

fc3 wrote:I know Mr. Gabachon you posted the chart the chart is no t the problem where im confussed is to get the magic numbers eg.
speed dominant, with low tilt and medium rotation. I get 100°±20°, 2.25:1-1.25:1 and pins of 2.5"-4" asym and 3"-5" sym.

Your benchmarks come out at:
60° / 3.25" / 40° asym
65° / 3.25" / 35° sym
I copied this from a previous post ....
How do you do the math is it 2.25-(1-1.25) or 2.25+1 seeing the eg. of 2.25:1 does that give you the pin of 3.25 and 2.25+ (1-1.25)=2.50 for the pin just confused sorry ...
the rest I do how to get the numbers is just that little part of math that is bothering me thanks :?:
Looks to me like the gold type is Kelly's answer to someone in another post maybe?
the numbers you are asking about are the ratios for a ratio range.

TOTALS:
There are 2 different sets of numbers. The first set are the totals. for example:
100* totals (+or- 20*) would mean you would use layouts with total sums of between 80* (for oil or longer patterns) to 120* (for drier or shorter patterns)

The second set of numbers has nothing to do with calculating the pin to pap distance.They are used to calculate how large of a drilling angle to use (and how large of a val angle)

RATIO RANGE NUMBERS:
The second set of numbers is the ratio range. In your question the 2.25:1 would be the highest ratio (which this bowler should comfortably use)
1.25:1 would be the lowest ratio (which this bowler should comfortably use)
Each layout would only use one or the other (or somewhere in-between).
These numbers are to calculate how many degrees of a drilling angle to use & how many degrees of a val angle to use.
These 2 calculated degree angles (drilling angle & val angle) have to add together and give you the total degrees which you have selected from TOTALS.

In Kelly's example above, the 60* 3.25 40* would equal a 1.5:1 ratio. (which would be described as somewhere in-between since he gave you a high and a low range)
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fc3
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Posts: 29
Joined: July 4th, 2011, 8:31 am
THS Average: 230
Positive Axis Point: 5 3/4 x3/8
Speed: 18/19 pindeck
Rev Rate: 350
Axis Tilt: 10
Axis Rotation: 60
Heavy Oil Ball: ALPHA MAX
Medium Oil Ball: 4.5 C SYSTEM RICO LAYOUT
Light Oil Ball: karma
Preferred Company: leos pro shop

Re: How to read the ratios

Post by fc3 »

Just like to thank to all you guys for the help especially to Mr. gavachon for taking the time to teach me this matter it was nice talking to you on 1 on 1 explanation thanks ... and will start using this ratios with the layouts so for your method is far from great and my customers are very happy cause now they truly see the results .
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Re: How to read the ratios

Post by elgavachon »

fc3 wrote:Just like to thank to all you guys for the help especially to Mr. gavachon for taking the time to teach me this matter it was nice talking to you on 1 on 1 explanation thanks ... and will start using this ratios with the layouts so for your method is far from great and my customers are very happy cause now they truly see the results .
Anytime
We are all here together and WELCOME to the forum.
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