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 Post subject: Cover dominant symmetricals, no thumb and balance hole blues
 Posted: Mon Aug 20, 2018 3:59 pm Post Number: #1 Post
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I’ve had a question for some time now. Has anyone who work with PBA pros who don’t use their thumb had the conversation about what they plan to drill when the no balance hole rule comes into effect? Take for example Tom Daugherty, he uses his Black Hammers a lot, with such a weak core and an early cover, without balance holes they react like a turd (my experience). Same with the Purple and even some reactives like the GB2, for me they all need a third hole. Some balls work fine without the third hole but with new balls it will be a coin toss. Will they be using mostly asymmetricals, is there a trick to set a PSA on the symmetricals or are we at the mercy of the core design and no PSA marking?


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 Post subject: Re: Cover dominant symmetricals, no thumb and balance hole b
 Posted: Wed Aug 22, 2018 10:19 pm Post Number: #2 Post
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TonyPR wrote:
I’ve had a question for some time now. Has anyone who work with PBA pros who don’t use their thumb had the conversation about what they plan to drill when the no balance hole rule comes into effect? Take for example Tom Daugherty, he uses his Black Hammers a lot, with such a weak core and an early cover, without balance holes they react like a turd (my experience). Same with the Purple and even some reactives like the GB2, for me they all need a third hole. Some balls work fine without the third hole but with new balls it will be a coin toss. Will they be using mostly asymmetricals, is there a trick to set a PSA on the symmetricals or are we at the mercy of the core design and no PSA marking?


I haven't followed all the rule changes coming up as thoroughly as most of you probably have, but my question is, is the PBA bound by USBC rules? If so, do they really have to be? Obviously, the Masters and the US Open are USBC tournaments. Unless things have changed, there are things allowed on Tour that are illegal under USBC rules, like switching hands on the fly.

I'm sure unless they absolutely have to, the PBA will ignore the balance hole ban. I mean, what can the USBC really do to the PBA? Unless the PBA receives funding from them, it's really none of their business what the PBA does.


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 Post subject: Re: Cover dominant symmetricals, no thumb and balance hole b
 Posted: Thu Aug 23, 2018 12:22 pm Post Number: #3 Post
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They aren’t allowed to “change hands on the fly”.

USBC sponsors PBA, they show USBC ads on the telecasts.


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 Post subject: Re: Cover dominant symmetricals, no thumb and balance hole b
 Posted: Fri Aug 24, 2018 2:10 am Post Number: #4 Post
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TonyPR wrote:
I’ve had a question for some time now. Has anyone who work with PBA pros who don’t use their thumb had the conversation about what they plan to drill when the no balance hole rule comes into effect? Take for example Tom Daugherty, he uses his Black Hammers a lot, with such a weak core and an early cover, without balance holes they react like a turd (my experience). Same with the Purple and even some reactives like the GB2, for me they all need a third hole. Some balls work fine without the third hole but with new balls it will be a coin toss. Will they be using mostly asymmetricals, is there a trick to set a PSA on the symmetricals or are we at the mercy of the core design and no PSA marking?

Tony,
My softball daughter is getting into bowling. She gravitated towards the 2 handed method.
I have yet to get release specs, it is very early in her bowling endeavors. She was a pitcher and knows how to impart different spin to a ball. Her initial coaching assignment from me is is about the ball motion and being able to get the ball to actually roll before hitting the pins. I am letting her figure things out on her own. She will figure out the physical motion needed. The skip step came naturally, I didn't have to say anything more than use a skip step similar to turning a double play and she just did it with excellent balance at the line.

I am wondering if I should get her to do the 2 handed thing but use her thumb to get the affect of having the thumb hole in the drilling?

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PAP 4.75" up 1/2"
45* rotation
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 Post subject: Re: Cover dominant symmetricals, no thumb and balance hole b
 Posted: Fri Aug 24, 2018 9:03 am Post Number: #5 Post
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I'd rather drill the ball with a slightly more flaring pin to pap distance than start adding a variance to the release. With the amount of ball available today you also could just buy a slightly higher diff ball as well to the desired flare with the pin to pap distance.

From my experience it will take away some of the ability to adjust roll with the thumb in plus it added an extra thing that could go slightly wrong in the relase.

I imagine bowling ball manufactures will more often time have weak asyms now and mark asyms under 10 similiar to the new matrix from ebonite.

ebonite has a psa range of 0.027, 0.021, 0.018, 0.007
hammer has a psa range of 0.016, 0.014, 0.012,
track has a psa range 0.020, 0.015, 0.014, 0.011, 0.010, 0.005,
columbia has a psa range of 0.020, 0.016
900 global has a psa range of 0.029, 0.024, 0.021, 0.017, 0.008,

And then you have storm, roto, brunswick, radical, dv8 as well, all offering some versatility in the psa range. I realise the offering is a lot less in the lower weight department though.


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 Post subject: Re: Cover dominant symmetricals, no thumb and balance hole b
 Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2018 9:34 pm Post Number: #6 Post
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EricHartwell wrote:
Tony,
My softball daughter is getting into bowling. She gravitated towards the 2 handed method.
I have yet to get release specs, it is very early in her bowling endeavors. She was a pitcher and knows how to impart different spin to a ball. Her initial coaching assignment from me is is about the ball motion and being able to get the ball to actually roll before hitting the pins. I am letting her figure things out on her own. She will figure out the physical motion needed. The skip step came naturally, I didn't have to say anything more than use a skip step similar to turning a double play and she just did it with excellent balance at the line.

I am wondering if I should get her to do the 2 handed thing but use her thumb to get the affect of having the thumb hole in the drilling?


I don't throw 2 handed but I don't use a thumb either. I would say if she is comfortable not using a thumb then I would not have a thumb drilled as that is just one more thing in the release that can go wrong for example the thumb sticking. If you decide to drill a thumb hole until the new rule takes effect to use as a balance hole then make sure that you recheck the PAP as it will change from having a thumb hole drilled and not having one drilled.

Jason

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PAP 6 1/4 over 0 up or down. Pap figured from the center of the bridge.
Rev Rate ~450
Speed 16.5 off the hand
Axis Tilt 10 Degrees
Axis Rotation 40-50 degrees
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 Post subject: Re: Cover dominant symmetricals, no thumb and balance hole b
 Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2018 9:44 pm Post Number: #7 Post
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TonyPR wrote:
I’ve had a question for some time now. Has anyone who work with PBA pros who don’t use their thumb had the conversation about what they plan to drill when the no balance hole rule comes into effect? Take for example Tom Daugherty, he uses his Black Hammers a lot, with such a weak core and an early cover, without balance holes they react like a turd (my experience). Same with the Purple and even some reactives like the GB2, for me they all need a third hole. Some balls work fine without the third hole but with new balls it will be a coin toss. Will they be using mostly asymmetricals, is there a trick to set a PSA on the symmetricals or are we at the mercy of the core design and no PSA marking?


I have been asking a similar question to no avail. They say in a drilled symmetrical ball the PSA is 6 3/4" from the low RG within 1/2" from centerline. This is true when a thumb hole is drilled into the ball and no balance hole but what about when neither is drilled into the ball. I don't know if no one knows or the right people just have not seen the post but I'm hoping somebody will answer either yours or mine.

_________________
PAP 6 1/4 over 0 up or down. Pap figured from the center of the bridge.
Rev Rate ~450
Speed 16.5 off the hand
Axis Tilt 10 Degrees
Axis Rotation 40-50 degrees
1 Hand 2 Finger Delivery


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