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 Post subject: Help needed - Polish and underlying surface question
 Posted: Fri Feb 23, 2018 3:42 am Post Number: #1 Post
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Does the ball surface under polish affect ball motion? For example: if I have a ball 500/Polish will it read the midland sooner than a ball with 1000/4000/Polish?

I’ve not used Polish much. I think my rev rate has jumped up quite a bit since my last lesson. My coach changed my approach which put me more in time and I have the same ball speed yet my ball....all of them are hooking directing into the face. The entire release is much cleaner, right leg gets out of the way, ball gets to my ankle, hand goes long, ball leaves cleanly, just everything is tons better so I’m pretty sure my rev rate has increased from 275. I don’t have time to check it before a tournament this weekend as I am traveling on business and won’t return in time to practice so I’m hoping for a Hail Mary shot of using Polish.

The ball I’m talking about in particular is at 500/4000, 60* x 4 1/2 x 50* - Radical Katana
Preferred area of play is straight up the 5 board on fresh THS - I’m still working on getting my brain to allow me to swing the ball out toward the gutter - Brain says yes I can do it up until I get to the line - then suddenly the ball goes straight as an arrow.

I have Abralon, Brunswick Crown Compound, storm step 2, Vise Compound, and Vise Polish.

I can’t back out if the tournament without losing my money so I might as well play.

Your help is truly appreciated!

_________________
Speed 17.5 off-hand
Rev 275
Tilt 17*
Rot 75*
PAP 4 over 1 3/8 up

Cash, More Cash, Katana x2, Fix, Quick Fix, Intel, Beyond Ridiculous, Tremendous Pearl, Guru Limited, Cyclops Pearl, True Motion & Radical Spare (Waiting to ship - Katana Slash)



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 Post subject: Re: Help needed - Polish and underlying surface question
 Posted: Fri Feb 23, 2018 5:56 am Post Number: #2 Post
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Jmc1972 wrote:
Does the ball surface under polish affect ball motion? For example: if I have a ball 500/Polish will it read the midland sooner than a ball with 1000/4000/Polish?


Short answer, yes. Polish on top of a rougher surface will behave differently than polish after finer grits. It will read the lane earlier. Personally, I love 500/Compound which is more like a 2500 grit finish.

You're proposing polish as a solution to what problem exactly? Throwing a ball that is too aggressive (Katana) for the conditions or the angles you're choosing to play?

Time to start opening up your angles a bit and work on rolling the ball away from the pocket (and then back again). At least parallel in and find some oil. Locate the area/angle that gives you hold to the left and hook to the right.

Steve

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18-19 mph (15.5-16.5 on monitor), 375 rpm, PAP 5 1/2 x 3/8 up, AT: 12*, AR: 45*


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 Post subject: Re: Help needed - Polish and underlying surface question
 Posted: Fri Feb 23, 2018 7:04 am Post Number: #3 Post
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stevespo wrote:

Short answer, yes. Polish on top of a rougher surface will behave differently than polish after finer grits. It will read the lane earlier. Personally, I love 500/Compound which is more like a 2500 grit finish.

You're proposing polish as a solution to what problem exactly? Throwing a ball that is too aggressive (Katana) for the conditions or the angles you're choosing to play?

Time to start opening up your angles a bit and work on rolling the ball away from the pocket (and then back again). At least parallel in and find some oil. Locate the area/angle that gives you hold to the left and hook to the right.

Steve


Hi Steve,

Essentially I’m looking for a quick bandaid for this weekend. I need to work on rolling away from the pocket and opening up my angles. It’s something I’ve wanted for a long time and just haven’t had the rev rate to do it. I’ve always been speed dominant. Before working with a coach my ball speed was 21 and I have always been a down and in player. Now I have a speed range of 16 to 21 and prefer to play at 17.5 (off-hand - all speeds are off hand) consistently as it gives me the best pin action.

I’ve not had time to practice this week as I’ve been out of town on business and won’t return home until tomorrow night which will give me just enough time to kiss the wife, eat dinner, and change the surface of the ball before heading to bed before getting up the next day to bowl the qualifying squad.

As it stands now the surface on the Katana is 500/4000. Playing down the 5 board on fresh I come straight into the face. If I move out, closer to the channel The ball goes further left (like it’s supposed to). I need roughly another foot either before the ball starts to hook or another foot before the ball rolls. Forgot to add that I also have Slip Agent.

So my options are:

Abralon - 160-4000 Grits
Crown Compound
Vise Compound
Storm Step 2 Compound
Vise Polish
Vise Slip Agent

I think that about covers it.

Next week I’ll be working on opening up my angles, using different focal points such as the 3, 6, 10 pins and spaces in between while coming in off boards other than the 5.

_________________
Speed 17.5 off-hand
Rev 275
Tilt 17*
Rot 75*
PAP 4 over 1 3/8 up

Cash, More Cash, Katana x2, Fix, Quick Fix, Intel, Beyond Ridiculous, Tremendous Pearl, Guru Limited, Cyclops Pearl, True Motion & Radical Spare (Waiting to ship - Katana Slash)



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 Post subject: Re: Help needed - Polish and underlying surface question
 Posted: Fri Feb 23, 2018 12:21 pm Post Number: #4 Post
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With all due respect, I don’t think the ball is the problem. If it’s a house pattern, straight up 5 is not the part of the lane that will give you the most margin of error, too much friction too soon front to back and too much friction side to side if you miss a board right. The Katana is designed to roll it away from the pocket and have it come back with a vengeance. If it’s a short sport pattern then playing up 5 may be an option but would be best with an early reading ball with a long arcing shape and an early roll, the Katana would be too angular for that. Play the line the lane tells you that will give you the most margin of error.

What pattern will you be playing on? Edited: I re read your original post and it’s a THS

Have you tried the Intel on that THS? Maybe 12-15 at the arrows out to around 10-8 at 40’
This will probably give you a greater margin of error.


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 Post subject: Re: Help needed - Polish and underlying surface question
 Posted: Fri Feb 23, 2018 1:20 pm Post Number: #5 Post
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TonyPR wrote:
With all due respect, I don’t think the ball is the problem. If it’s a house pattern, straight up 5 is not the part of the lane that will give you the most margin of error, too much friction too soon front to back and too much friction side to side if you miss a board right. The Katana is designed to roll it away from the pocket and have it come back with a vengeance. If it’s a short sport pattern then playing up 5 may be an option but would be best with an early reading ball with a long arcing shape and an early roll, the Katana would be too angular for that. Play the line the lane tells you that will give you the most margin of error.

What pattern will you be playing on? Edited: I re read your original post and it’s a THS

Have you tried the Intel on that THS? Maybe 12-15 at the arrows out to around 10-8 at 40’
This will probably give you a greater margin of error.


Have the exact same problem with my Intel and Beyond playing straight up 10. What worked befor my last lesson and honestly worked several shots the week after my lesson, while my release wasn’t quite in its groove yet, doesn’t work any longer.

The house I play has their own shot - so they say - and the Katana was working great straight up 5,the Beyond worked great straight up 10, and the Intel worked great straight up 10. The layouts on those other 2 balls are to play that way as is the Katana for me to play up 5.

_________________
Speed 17.5 off-hand
Rev 275
Tilt 17*
Rot 75*
PAP 4 over 1 3/8 up

Cash, More Cash, Katana x2, Fix, Quick Fix, Intel, Beyond Ridiculous, Tremendous Pearl, Guru Limited, Cyclops Pearl, True Motion & Radical Spare (Waiting to ship - Katana Slash)



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 Post subject: Re: Help needed - Polish and underlying surface question
 Posted: Fri Feb 23, 2018 1:55 pm Post Number: #6 Post
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Are you able to adjust your release to more up the back? Maybe lowering your axis rotation and/or increasing speed a bit is the trick. From what you wrote it seems adjusting ball speed is a skill you have in your bag, more speed equals more length.


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 Post subject: Re: Help needed - Polish and underlying surface question
 Posted: Fri Feb 23, 2018 2:26 pm Post Number: #7 Post
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TonyPR wrote:
Are you able to adjust your release to more up the back? Maybe lowering your axis rotation and/or increasing speed a bit is the trick. From what you wrote it seems adjusting ball speed is a skill you have in your bag, more speed equals more length.


I can and it may be what I wind up doing, the only issue I run into with that is that I run out of energy. Depending on how far I go in the event it cound backfire. It’s another area of my game that I’m working on.

If I can bowl at 17.5 I can bowl an 8 games qualifier with fatigue setting in around game 6 and can push through for the last 2. Bowling at higher speeds than that I have nothing left for the last 2 games.

If I need to bowl at a higher speed I will. Hoping to change the surface. Maybe I’ll use an old ball and wear down 4000 pad and use that on the ball.

_________________
Speed 17.5 off-hand
Rev 275
Tilt 17*
Rot 75*
PAP 4 over 1 3/8 up

Cash, More Cash, Katana x2, Fix, Quick Fix, Intel, Beyond Ridiculous, Tremendous Pearl, Guru Limited, Cyclops Pearl, True Motion & Radical Spare (Waiting to ship - Katana Slash)



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