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 Post subject: Ball Surface ?
 Posted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 5:03 pm Post Number: #1 Post
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I have a More Cash with a Layout of 15 x 4 3/4 x 30 with factory 500/2000 finish. My stats are:

Speed 17.5 off hand
Rev 275
Tilt 17*
Rotation 75*
PAP 4 over 1 3/8 up

If I’ve been reading correctly on dual angles this layout has less skid, revs up early, transitions quickly, comes off the break point slowly and would be best used on medium patterns - is this correct?

Also, would this give me a ball motion similar to that of a ball that’s pin down? I’m not sure this layout is good for me and would love to hear your thoughts.

I have a ball spinner and plenty of Abralon with grits ranging from 180 to 4000 and can change the surface easily.

I compete on both THS and Sport and haven’t used this ball because it doesn’t move - I guess I could use it as an Asym Spare ball or for dry conditions which it’s not meant for. I had to go out and pick up a Cash because it wasn’t working - I will say it could have also been me not rolling the ball properly and giving up on basic mechanics out of frustration.

I’m open to all suggestions.....thank you.

_________________
Speed 17.5 off-hand
Rev 275
Tilt 17*
Rot 75*
PAP 4 over 1 3/8 up

Cash, More Cash, Katana x2, Fix, Quick Fix, Intel, Beyond Ridiculous, Tremendous Pearl, Guru Limited, Cyclops Pearl, True Motion & Radical Spare (Waiting to ship - Katana Slash)



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 Post subject: Re: Ball Surface ?
 Posted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 5:24 pm Post Number: #2 Post
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That layout has a total sum of 45! I would guess it hooks at your toes and is hooked out by 20' down the lane. Might work if someone tips the jug of conditioner over on the lane.

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* MPH @ aarows
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PAP 3 3/4"
(* rebuilding)

“The good thing about science is that it's true whether or not you believe in it.”
― Neil deGrasse Tyson


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 Post subject: Re: Ball Surface ?
 Posted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 5:43 pm Post Number: #3 Post
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Dustin is right the totals are too low.

Before plugging and redrilling you could try progressively sanding it 1000, 2000, 4000 until is is very shbiny and throw it fast. It is currently drilled for a very speed dominant bowler.

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Eric Hartwell

Right Handed
PAP 4.75" up 1/2"
45* rotation
12* tilt
330 rev rate
16 mph off hand


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 Post subject: Re: Ball Surface ?
 Posted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 5:47 pm Post Number: #4 Post
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EricHartwell wrote:
Dustin is right the totals are too low.

Before plugging and redrilling you could try progressively sanding it 1000, 2000, 4000 until is is very shbiny and throw it fast. It is currently drilled for a very speed dominant bowler.


I also have slip agent and polish. Maybe I’ll add that to the mix as well. Someone on this forum gave me that layout for the ball along with layout for 4 others based on my stats and I’ve wasted over a thousand $ having to buy new gear or having to plug a d redrill gear.

Thanks!

_________________
Speed 17.5 off-hand
Rev 275
Tilt 17*
Rot 75*
PAP 4 over 1 3/8 up

Cash, More Cash, Katana x2, Fix, Quick Fix, Intel, Beyond Ridiculous, Tremendous Pearl, Guru Limited, Cyclops Pearl, True Motion & Radical Spare (Waiting to ship - Katana Slash)



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 Post subject: Re: Ball Surface ?
 Posted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 5:50 pm Post Number: #5 Post
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Dustin wrote:
That layout has a total sum of 45! I would guess it hooks at your toes and is hooked out by 20' down the lane. Might work if someone tips the jug of conditioner over on the lane.


Someone in this forum recommended I have it payed out that way based on my specs to have a ball that is based on the “old MoRich hook layout” when I need something to hook when nothing else will.

He also gave me layouts for 4 other balls that were complete BS - none of them worked worth a darn and I’ve wasted over a grand in replacing or plugging and redrilling them.

_________________
Speed 17.5 off-hand
Rev 275
Tilt 17*
Rot 75*
PAP 4 over 1 3/8 up

Cash, More Cash, Katana x2, Fix, Quick Fix, Intel, Beyond Ridiculous, Tremendous Pearl, Guru Limited, Cyclops Pearl, True Motion & Radical Spare (Waiting to ship - Katana Slash)



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 Post subject: Re: Ball Surface ?
 Posted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 6:37 pm Post Number: #6 Post
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Sorry to hear they didn't work out. Just wondering if the balls are being used on the correct conditions, not second guessing you just looking for reasons why they didn't work. I remember the Cash layout was for when nothing else would hook meaning the lane needs to be very oily to work right. Did you drill them all right away or did you drill up 1 or 2 see how they worked and went from there.

_________________
* MPH @ aarows
* RPM
AR *
AT *
PAP 3 3/4"
(* rebuilding)

“The good thing about science is that it's true whether or not you believe in it.”
― Neil deGrasse Tyson


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 Post subject: Re: Ball Surface ?
 Posted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 6:54 pm Post Number: #7 Post
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Dustin wrote:
Sorry to hear they didn't work out. Just wondering if the balls are being used on the correct conditions, not second guessing you just looking for reasons why they didn't work. I remember the Cash layout was for when nothing else would hook meaning the lane needs to be very oily to work right. Did you drill them all right away or did you drill up 1 or 2 see how they worked and went from there.


They were all drilled up at the same time. My PSO gave me a break on the price by doing them all at the same time. I wish I would have waited. I’ve not had any proper reaction with More Cash, The Fix, not the Katana and that’s with using them on the conditions they were supposedly meant for based on what I was told in the post.

I bout a new Katana, a Cash, and a Quick Fix and Mo gave me layouts for them which are completely different and they work beautifully. All I need to do is change the surface based on condition. My layouts are either 45 x 4 1/2 x 50, 50 x 4 1/2 x 45, or 60 x 4 1/2 x 50 (Katana) for exerything.

I’m really hoping I don’t have to plug the More Cash and can find a way to make it work.

_________________
Speed 17.5 off-hand
Rev 275
Tilt 17*
Rot 75*
PAP 4 over 1 3/8 up

Cash, More Cash, Katana x2, Fix, Quick Fix, Intel, Beyond Ridiculous, Tremendous Pearl, Guru Limited, Cyclops Pearl, True Motion & Radical Spare (Waiting to ship - Katana Slash)



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 Post subject: Re: Ball Surface ?
 Posted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 8:23 pm Post Number: #8 Post
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Glad you got the layouts from the horses mouth. Try adding surface and see what happens. Good luck!

_________________
* MPH @ aarows
* RPM
AR *
AT *
PAP 3 3/4"
(* rebuilding)

“The good thing about science is that it's true whether or not you believe in it.”
― Neil deGrasse Tyson


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 Post subject: Re: Ball Surface ?
 Posted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 8:45 pm Post Number: #9 Post
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Dustin wrote:
Glad you got the layouts from the horses mouth. Try adding surface and see what happens. Good luck!


Thanks, just went 500/3000/4000/Polish. I’ll try it tomorrow and bring some Abralon with me and see what happens. I’m going to call and have Chichen Itza put down.

_________________
Speed 17.5 off-hand
Rev 275
Tilt 17*
Rot 75*
PAP 4 over 1 3/8 up

Cash, More Cash, Katana x2, Fix, Quick Fix, Intel, Beyond Ridiculous, Tremendous Pearl, Guru Limited, Cyclops Pearl, True Motion & Radical Spare (Waiting to ship - Katana Slash)



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 Post subject: Re: Ball Surface ?
 Posted: Sun Feb 18, 2018 6:59 pm Post Number: #10 Post
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Dustin wrote:
Glad you got the layouts from the horses mouth. Try adding surface and see what happens. Good luck!


Tried the ball at 500/3000/4000/Polish and it was good for about 3 frames of fresh then it just flat out lost energy. It’s back to the drawing board.

I may have to go 1000/3000/4000/Polish but then it may not get to the pocket - I have Slip Agent which would create the same problem. Sadly I may be left with either selling and getting a new one or plugging and redrilling.

_________________
Speed 17.5 off-hand
Rev 275
Tilt 17*
Rot 75*
PAP 4 over 1 3/8 up

Cash, More Cash, Katana x2, Fix, Quick Fix, Intel, Beyond Ridiculous, Tremendous Pearl, Guru Limited, Cyclops Pearl, True Motion & Radical Spare (Waiting to ship - Katana Slash)



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 Post subject: Re: Ball Surface ?
 Posted: Sun Feb 18, 2018 8:13 pm Post Number: #11 Post
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Jmc1972 wrote:

Tried the ball at 500/3000/4000/Polish and it was good for about 3 frames of fresh then it just flat out lost energy. It’s back to the drawing board.

I may have to go 1000/3000/4000/Polish but then it may not get to the pocket - I have Slip Agent which would create the same problem. Sadly I may be left with either selling and getting a new one or plugging and redrilling.

It seems that you have not used it on a condition that nothing else is working. Have you bowled on any patterns 45' or longer?
It is a Very condition specific ball at this point.
It is difficult to have a ball in the arsenal that is rarely used. It seems like money wasted until it comes in handy. My Tremendous is like that with a strong midlane drilling. I need 43'+ for it to be effective. When I do use it it's only for 1 game to break in a line, then I ball down. I have yet to consider shining it up to make it more usable. I knew going in it was going to be a role player in the arsenal not one of the shining stars.

_________________
Eric Hartwell

Right Handed
PAP 4.75" up 1/2"
45* rotation
12* tilt
330 rev rate
16 mph off hand


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 Post subject: Re: Ball Surface ?
 Posted: Sun Feb 18, 2018 10:24 pm Post Number: #12 Post
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EricHartwell wrote:
It seems that you have not used it on a condition that nothing else is working. Have you bowled on any patterns 45' or longer?
It is a Very condition specific ball at this point.
It is difficult to have a ball in the arsenal that is rarely used. It seems like money wasted until it comes in handy. My Tremendous is like that with a strong midlane drilling. I need 43'+ for it to be effective. When I do use it it's only for 1 game to break in a line, then I ball down. I have yet to consider shining it up to make it more usable. I knew going in it was going to be a role player in the arsenal not one of the shining stars.


I haven’t yet. Maybe that’s what I’ll do since I have the Cash. Would you recommend going back to factory finish with the layout being so aggressive? It seems entirely too aggressive for anything at 500/2000. I could go 500/2000/Polish or possibly 500/2000/Crown Compound.

I have a number of items at my disposal:

180-4000 grit Abralon
Crown Compound
Vise Compound
Storm Step 2
Vise Slip Agent
Vise Polish
Powerhouse Clean & Dull
That Purple Stuff

_________________
Speed 17.5 off-hand
Rev 275
Tilt 17*
Rot 75*
PAP 4 over 1 3/8 up

Cash, More Cash, Katana x2, Fix, Quick Fix, Intel, Beyond Ridiculous, Tremendous Pearl, Guru Limited, Cyclops Pearl, True Motion & Radical Spare (Waiting to ship - Katana Slash)



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 Post subject: Re: Ball Surface ?
 Posted: Sun Feb 18, 2018 10:31 pm Post Number: #13 Post
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I would take it back to factory 500/2000. I wouldn't plug up the pores with polish. You will want it to soak up oil and break down a line for one of your shining stars to come through in the finish.

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Eric Hartwell

Right Handed
PAP 4.75" up 1/2"
45* rotation
12* tilt
330 rev rate
16 mph off hand


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