"Speed" description in profile

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MattInTheHat
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"Speed" description in profile

Post by MattInTheHat »

I just noticed that the description for Speed in UCP profile page says "This is your speed at the pin deck." Shouldn't the description be "This is the speed off your hand", since that is what we always ask people for?
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Re: "Speed" description in profile

Post by MegaMav »

Most know their speed at the end of the lane, and we make an estimate for hand speed based on that.

When I set that up, I figured most knew only by Quibica or radar speed, and not video measured.

-Eric
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Re: "Speed" description in profile

Post by Mo Pinel »

MegaMav wrote:Most know their speed at the end of the lane, and we make an estimate for hand speed based on that.

When I set that up, I figured most knew only by Quibica or radar speed, and not video measured.

-Eric
Make sense to me, but the scorer speed is measured at the camera (approx. 52 ft down the lane).
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MattInTheHat
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Re: "Speed" description in profile

Post by MattInTheHat »

I understand the reasoning, just concerned it sends a mixed message.
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Re: "Speed" description in profile

Post by MegaMav »

Im not sure what can be done to resolve this in an easy manner.
Most users really only know their 52 foot radar speed.
Do you want me to change it to, "The speed measured by radar?"

Im not sure there is that much difference.
I just didnt want users to be confused by foul line speed and speed measured by the radar.
It just seems radar speed is the most widely known speed measurement.

Im open to discussion on this.

-Eric
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Re: "Speed" description in profile

Post by scotts33 »

I see the issue being that most cameras at back end are not that reliable. Qubica probably being the best of them.

Here's an example. A player is playing down and in on a straight line to the pocket vs. a player playing in say crossing the arrows at 18 out to 7 and then back into the pocket. The bowler that is playing straighter the camera always seems to read these ball speeds higher vs. the player that plays a swing trajectory. This makes sense in a way but I don't believe it be very accurate. Also think about the speed on your spare ball shooting corners vs. your strike shot. Spare balls always show up at a higher speed in my experience on backend cameras.

I really don't know a solution to this but most players estimate their ball speed and revs higher than they are normally....something about a testosterone thing. I fit golfers on a regular basis as a clubmaker/fitter and during the fitting session I do an interview I'd say over 80% over estimate their swing speeds and how far they hit the ball with a driver or any club for that matter. It's more about what they'd like to see vs. reality.
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Re: "Speed" description in profile

Post by magicmike »

A ball that is not hooking (Ex plastic ball thrown at a spare) will be a very noticeable amoutn faster than a reactive ball that is hooking. Most people throw harder at spares as well as a mental thing, but the nature of less hand/a much lower friction surface makes a plastic ball skate and use less energy than a reactive ball thus allowing it to retain more velocity as it goes down the lane.

It doesn't seem unreasonable at all to see 2mph difference or so between strike and spare shots.

And consider a high friction surface and hooking the ball a lot, or just using the dry on a house shot, your ball is going to slow down a lot.
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Re: "Speed" description in profile

Post by MattInTheHat »

Sorry, didn't mean to cause a problem. I'm not sure what the best solution would be either, I was just thinking that the description in the profile contradicts what we always ask people to give us when getting their specs. Like I said I understand the reasoning, it's easy to just look at the monitor speed instead of setting up a camera et all. Mike and Scott also make a good point about the potential inaccuracy of the camera speeds.
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Re: "Speed" description in profile

Post by mozarkian »

I don't get a chance to bowl on a lane with speed readings very often. I make it a point to do it every couple of months to see if my speed has changed as my delivery has changed. Last week I experimented with all five of my balls and discovered that the average speed reading was different for each ball. I did my best to keep my timing consistent with this result: Storm Ice spare ball 18.8-19.2; RipR 14.0-14.4; 916AT 14.4-14.8; LevRG Solid 15.0-15.4; Bedlam 15.8-16.2.

Am I doing something weird or would this result be normal because of how far the balls skid?
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Re: "Speed" description in profile

Post by JohnP »

Would there be any way to put the speed in then add where and how measured? -- JohnP
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Re: "Speed" description in profile

Post by MegaMav »

I've updated the field to 25 characters max with the description:

Speed:
Your ball speed. (Also, indicate where its measured. Camera/Foul Line/Pindeck)

Good enough?
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Re: "Speed" description in profile

Post by MattCosta7 »

MegaMav wrote:I've updated the field to 25 characters max with the description:

Speed:
Your ball speed. (Also, indicate where its measured. Camera/Foul Line/Pindeck)

Good enough?

sounds like a plan!
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Re: "Speed" description in profile

Post by russelldean »

"A ball that is not hooking (Ex plastic ball thrown at a spare) will be a very noticeable amoutn faster than a reactive ball that is hooking. Most people throw harder at spares as well as a mental thing, but the nature of less hand/a much lower friction surface makes a plastic ball skate and use less energy than a reactive ball thus allowing it to retain more velocity as it goes down the lane.
It doesn't seem unreasonable at all to see 2mph difference or so between strike and spare shots.
And consider a high friction surface and hooking the ball a lot, or just using the dry on a house shot, your ball is going to slow down a lot".

Great points Mike.
An agreesive reactive ball, will slow down over 2 mph between the outside of the lane, and the middle on most house shots. Also, lane surface will make a big difference. Worn wood, to low friction synthetic another 2 mph or more. Also house to house and lane to lane, calibration very inconsistent. Speed gun or stop watch is best bet. I think there is a conversion chart for speed on the wiki.
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MattInTheHat
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Re: "Speed" description in profile

Post by MattInTheHat »

That looks like a good solution Mav.
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Re: "Speed" description in profile

Post by pneumatic »

I like it (just updated my profile 8-) )
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